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on this episode of skeptico

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a show about making our puzzle pieces

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fit

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it's almost like a reflection in the

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external world from an internal

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experience i've heard many people and i

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resonate with this that when they have

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psychedelic experiences or near-death

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experiences it almost feels like they're

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given this internal map or this internal

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puzzle and they want to

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find all the pieces out here

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that match up with that internal puzzle

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that's andy rouse from the deep share

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podcast i have a great chat coming up

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with him we did kind of a swap cast

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thing and i thought it was great so

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we're gonna do it again i think we left

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some really intriguing loose ends that

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will might tie up in the future but in

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the meantime we rolled right into this

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one so

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i don't think much of an introduction is

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necessary here we go andy from deep

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shear podcast

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i'm probably going to rattle your cage

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at some point maybe you'll rattle mine

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but what i really hope is that you'll

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kind of fill in some gaps for me because

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this is vice versa vice versa my friend

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so i sent you this survey and you were

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nice enough to fill it out and your

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answers are quite brilliant and i'm not

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just saying that i i very very deep i'm

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like man i knew i was going to like this

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guy

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[Laughter]

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yeah college i've been thinking about uh

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having this conversation with you for

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quite a while because out of the

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plethora of amazing people that we all

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get to talk to in this community uh what

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i really admire about you is your

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drive to you just never let anybody off

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the hook

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about certain things and i love that

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because i tend to be a little

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non-confrontational

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and i need a little bit of influence to

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really

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get my confidence about me and be like

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hey listen i need to i need to ask that

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again because you're still really not

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answering my question you know what i

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mean and i really admire that about you

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well i i do know what you mean but it's

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it's tricky isn't it because it is

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yeah you don't want to cut off a

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conversation entirely you don't want to

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like alienate someone

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you don't want to be a prick but

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sometimes that's what's needed right i

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listened to a great conversation that

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you had well it was starting to be a

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great conversation from like man this

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was back in like 2014 i think with that

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neurobiologist what was her name i can't

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remember off the top of my head but she

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uh

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made a million excuses how nothing was

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working and she just had to cut off the

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conversation and you were drilling her

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you were quoting her own book and she

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couldn't back up what she was claiming

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it was it was just classic

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well

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there's so many jumping off points for

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that you know because like one of the

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things about like that interview and

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what people have kind of

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said about skeptico and there is some

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truth to it because it always happens

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for all of us you know it's like hey the

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guys on my team i'm going to kind of

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treat them one way and the guys on the

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other team i'm going to go for blood you

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know

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so when she's on the other team like

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that which she is you know materialist

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scientist really kind of

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clueless in my in my

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world view you know she needs to be

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confronted with hey this is this is a

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reality that that you know

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that you have to accept you have to at

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least deal with right right can we pause

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for one second sure no problem sorry

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no worries i'll take that time to

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introduce the show hey everybody welcome

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back to the deep share

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this morning i have

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alex sicaris from skeptico with me and

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i've been waiting to have this

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conversation for a while

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uh alex is the author of skeptico of

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course he's also the author of why

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science is wrong

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about almost everything

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um it's it's a pleasure to have him here

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because i've been following his work for

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so long and he's interested in so many

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of the topics that i find fascinating

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like near-death experience you know

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extra sensory procession

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perceptions and

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experiences of that nature but um you

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know alex is interested in a lot of

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different topics as am i so we're

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probably going to get into a number of

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different things that um don't

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necessarily relate to near-death

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experience but as i've told him off the

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air i think

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it's natural for us to

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talk about the very material conspiracy

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theories that we get into and find

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interesting and it naturally moves us

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towards

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that more personal

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conversation about consciousness

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so

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i hope you guys have a great time

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listening to this conversation with me

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and alex and uh alex has returned

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has managed to

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rally in the puppy

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i am so sorry man oh no worries no

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worries okay you have the ability to

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edit that back into uh you know what i

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took the time to just give a little

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intro and honestly that's another thing

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i don't even normally do i like barely

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give intros just because i'm caught up

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in the moment so yeah who's perfectly

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so

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appreciate you being here man

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thank you andy i think we're gonna have

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uh i think we're gonna have a great

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conversation

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that's what i was leading up to

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you know

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in what we were talking about before

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because

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one of the things that the way i put it

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is you know right and you understood

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right away because you go yep and it's

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like

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we wind up in our silos where we're you

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know just kind of talking to each other

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and everything makes sense and it's

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coherent and then somebody comes in

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outside you know and like so my thing

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one of my things

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is ufos and e.t along with near-death

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experience along with out-of-body

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experience along with evil and along

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with you know

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uh

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all that stuff so every time somebody

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gets settled i'm the guy who's going

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wait a minute you're in your silo what

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happens when you come out of your silo

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and look at this other stuff

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you're nodding so you have i appreciate

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that yes i think uh you know

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subconsciously you probably influenced

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me in some way to to uh take that

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approach confidently at times because

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it's

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yeah i i kind of try to throw a wrench

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in the spokes well i don't try to but i

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have the wrenches and i have to throw

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them

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you know i'm sure you can relate to that

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because sometimes it's like you know

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well i strongly feel that everyone in

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this community has a piece of the puzzle

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to offer but sometimes they don't even

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understand their own puzzle i think a

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lot of us need each other to kind of

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shine the the lights in different ways

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on each other's puzzle pieces to kind of

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see what that puzzle piece really means

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and where it really fits you know people

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say demons and angels but

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then again you could say depression or

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or confidence you know it's it's a

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gradient of experience that the more we

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accept into the world view the more we

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can kind of

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see what's really going on i try not to

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throw too much out i want to keep as

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much in as possible and see

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where something might be more metaphor

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than than

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dense physicality perhaps you know

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especially in this realm that we're

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talking about near-death experience and

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all that if that made any sense alex

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it makes total sense the good side and

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bad side of that is it kind of does

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bring exactly what we're talking about

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into focus and in terms of the challenge

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there because like i don't necessarily

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agree with uh with what you're saying i

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always come to the like one

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way i put it is like a litmus test you

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know

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like at every

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angle that you go down you know

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angels demons depression

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you know uh

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litmus test so i i i'm not quick to just

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brush past even the point that well

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everyone has a piece of the puzzle

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no

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but

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also going with that

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or where we can take it that i'd so

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totally agree with and this is where i

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need to grow

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is

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like you are

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a really cool dude i can tell

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no i could tell i'm listen i'm reading

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these these survey answers that you gave

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me and i'm like

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immediately and you know this from kind

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of deep share right it's like

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because i've heard you say this that you

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have this cool community now you know

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you've built this cool community of

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people like

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bro i get it you get me i get you

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now that's how i immediately feel with

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you because you know i'm asking you

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science and you go it's uh it's a method

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it's not a position statement it's

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inextricably linked to scientific

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materialism like bing already

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everything is consciousness you write

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that's what you wrote as an answer the

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paradox somehow allows this experience

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brilliant so i'm like i'm all over this

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guy in terms of we're like bros

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on the other hand

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so i don't want to

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alienate you or piss you off because

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like

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you can be my friend you know what i

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mean but at the same time if we're gonna

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talk about the box saga

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i'm gonna go man that sounds like

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[\h__\h] to me nice thank god finally

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someone that at least comments because

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it's either this is too weird i don't

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even want to touch it or wow this is

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really interesting and kind of just

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following along with what i'm saying

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about it

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i would yeah that's a different threat

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altogether but yeah i am looking for

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debates about that because i don't like

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what i'm finding necessarily in some

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areas of that story so i want to know

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what's going on there and

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why it fits so well in some places you

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know but again that's another thread

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altogether but a great example that you

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brought up

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and it's a great thread to go down

282
00:10:15,190 --> 00:10:13,519
because like

283
00:10:17,269 --> 00:10:15,200
we'll just go down it right now because

284
00:10:18,870 --> 00:10:17,279
your listeners know about it we'll just

285
00:10:23,030 --> 00:10:18,880
do a 30-second

286
00:10:25,990 --> 00:10:23,040
flyby is i'd say that the reason

287
00:10:29,110 --> 00:10:26,000
why it resonates the reason why it's

288
00:10:32,470 --> 00:10:29,120
true is because it's well crafted it's

289
00:10:35,990 --> 00:10:32,480
kind of like christianity

290
00:10:38,630 --> 00:10:36,000
why it [\h__\h] works so well as a social

291
00:10:40,949 --> 00:10:38,640
engineering mind control project is

292
00:10:43,430 --> 00:10:40,959
because a lot of it is really solid from

293
00:10:45,509 --> 00:10:43,440
a spiritual perspective but from a

294
00:10:48,870 --> 00:10:45,519
historical perspective it really kind of

295
00:10:50,069 --> 00:10:48,880
breaks down and then from mind control

296
00:10:51,990 --> 00:10:50,079
how do i

297
00:10:54,790 --> 00:10:52,000
use this to

298
00:10:56,870 --> 00:10:54,800
kind of shepherd people into my little

299
00:10:58,470 --> 00:10:56,880
club there's all these other things

300
00:11:00,790 --> 00:10:58,480
built then so

301
00:11:03,190 --> 00:11:00,800
the fact that it's brilliant

302
00:11:05,110 --> 00:11:03,200
just for millions and millions of people

303
00:11:07,269 --> 00:11:05,120
it's still something they can't get over

304
00:11:10,230 --> 00:11:07,279
they're like no but i had this brilliant

305
00:11:12,550 --> 00:11:10,240
spiritual experience through my practice

306
00:11:14,870 --> 00:11:12,560
of christianity i'm like of course you

307
00:11:17,030 --> 00:11:14,880
did or like if you say you know the bach

308
00:11:18,630 --> 00:11:17,040
saga it really resonates and isn't this

309
00:11:20,710 --> 00:11:18,640
true and interesting and what about the

310
00:11:21,590 --> 00:11:20,720
connection to language and sound like

311
00:11:26,630 --> 00:11:21,600
yeah

312
00:11:30,389 --> 00:11:26,640
it together but that doesn't mean it's

313
00:11:32,310 --> 00:11:30,399
real either interesting yeah well i

314
00:11:33,430 --> 00:11:32,320
really appreciate that and i think that

315
00:11:35,829 --> 00:11:33,440
maybe

316
00:11:37,430 --> 00:11:35,839
down the line somewhere if i were to do

317
00:11:39,350 --> 00:11:37,440
a like a proper

318
00:11:41,430 --> 00:11:39,360
debate form with like notes and

319
00:11:43,990 --> 00:11:41,440
everything maybe you'd like to be a part

320
00:11:45,910 --> 00:11:44,000
of it i don't know i mean it's kind of

321
00:11:47,910 --> 00:11:45,920
it's a rabbit hole to go down even just

322
00:11:49,110 --> 00:11:47,920
to understand enough to debate it of

323
00:11:51,350 --> 00:11:49,120
course but

324
00:11:53,430 --> 00:11:51,360
but yeah that's that's i'm i'm glad that

325
00:11:56,629 --> 00:11:53,440
you have that perspective because often

326
00:11:58,629 --> 00:11:56,639
i don't find that you know

327
00:12:01,110 --> 00:11:58,639
so it helps but um yeah the language

328
00:12:04,310 --> 00:12:01,120
stuff in itself um yeah i think where it

329
00:12:07,110 --> 00:12:04,320
resonates for me is how it kind of

330
00:12:08,710 --> 00:12:07,120
so let me put it this way

331
00:12:12,550 --> 00:12:08,720
i do

332
00:12:14,870 --> 00:12:12,560
think something about it feels like it's

333
00:12:15,990 --> 00:12:14,880
the other end of the stick

334
00:12:17,509 --> 00:12:16,000
like

335
00:12:18,949 --> 00:12:17,519
you have this

336
00:12:21,990 --> 00:12:18,959
constant

337
00:12:25,350 --> 00:12:22,000
from a long time ago feud between this

338
00:12:27,750 --> 00:12:25,360
more natural way and this more

339
00:12:30,069 --> 00:12:27,760
artificial way i guess you could call it

340
00:12:32,550 --> 00:12:30,079
but they're both really the same people

341
00:12:35,670 --> 00:12:32,560
it's almost like a family feud and it's

342
00:12:37,509 --> 00:12:35,680
like if the box saga has any truth to it

343
00:12:39,509 --> 00:12:37,519
it doesn't mean that it's the way we

344
00:12:41,150 --> 00:12:39,519
should all be going back to by any means

345
00:12:43,910 --> 00:12:41,160
but it would be the more

346
00:12:46,389 --> 00:12:43,920
naturalistic way like it's the heathen

347
00:12:49,190 --> 00:12:46,399
the pagan the worship of nature more

348
00:12:51,670 --> 00:12:49,200
than move on from that expand outward

349
00:12:54,150 --> 00:12:51,680
build machines become the new thing it's

350
00:12:56,550 --> 00:12:54,160
a very old versus new kind of mentality

351
00:12:58,310 --> 00:12:56,560
that i constantly see out there but then

352
00:13:00,550 --> 00:12:58,320
again that also feels like a galleon

353
00:13:02,790 --> 00:13:00,560
dialectic as well

354
00:13:04,790 --> 00:13:02,800
i don't know it's a big topic

355
00:13:07,030 --> 00:13:04,800
to get into for sure

356
00:13:09,670 --> 00:13:07,040
right i mean it kind of cuts both ways

357
00:13:12,949 --> 00:13:09,680
there it's like the the part you landed

358
00:13:14,790 --> 00:13:12,959
on on the end is kind of more what i was

359
00:13:16,230 --> 00:13:14,800
saying right andy it's like

360
00:13:19,509 --> 00:13:16,240
yeah it's

361
00:13:22,230 --> 00:13:19,519
it's picking up some themes some

362
00:13:24,389 --> 00:13:22,240
metaphors some archetypes that do

363
00:13:25,430 --> 00:13:24,399
resonate with us and have some deeper

364
00:13:28,069 --> 00:13:25,440
truth

365
00:13:30,230 --> 00:13:28,079
but what does that mean in terms of

366
00:13:32,230 --> 00:13:30,240
inquiry you perpetuate doubt you know so

367
00:13:34,069 --> 00:13:32,240
skeptico that's my ethos i didn't

368
00:13:37,509 --> 00:13:34,079
realize it even at the time that i named

369
00:13:41,030 --> 00:13:37,519
the show but inquiry to perpetuate doubt

370
00:13:43,430 --> 00:13:41,040
i am want to be doubtful because that to

371
00:13:46,150 --> 00:13:43,440
me is a spiritual process

372
00:13:50,230 --> 00:13:46,160
when i settle on something when i know

373
00:13:52,470 --> 00:13:50,240
something ah it's over i've lost

374
00:13:56,310 --> 00:13:52,480
exactly it's over i've lost it i've lost

375
00:13:58,550 --> 00:13:56,320
it when i'm always reaching and for me

376
00:14:01,269 --> 00:13:58,560
that's kind of a doubt you know so my

377
00:14:04,230 --> 00:14:01,279
point would be rather than to find

378
00:14:05,670 --> 00:14:04,240
the resonance with the box saga

379
00:14:08,069 --> 00:14:05,680
yeah there has to be some otherwise i'm

380
00:14:09,670 --> 00:14:08,079
not drawn in right right once i find the

381
00:14:11,910 --> 00:14:09,680
the resonance okay

382
00:14:14,550 --> 00:14:11,920
how can i tear this apart right is there

383
00:14:17,310 --> 00:14:14,560
any one thing because all it takes is is

384
00:14:20,310 --> 00:14:17,320
one thing you know that that is an

385
00:14:23,189 --> 00:14:20,320
irrecoverable kind of falsehood you know

386
00:14:25,990 --> 00:14:23,199
and then you go oh okay well i i would

387
00:14:28,150 --> 00:14:26,000
just to that i would say the problem is

388
00:14:30,230 --> 00:14:28,160
the a lot of the holes you could

389
00:14:32,629 --> 00:14:30,240
possibly find in something like the bach

390
00:14:34,550 --> 00:14:32,639
saga would then have to be looked at

391
00:14:37,670 --> 00:14:34,560
with a keen eye too because it's coming

392
00:14:39,990 --> 00:14:37,680
from say a catholic run society and we

393
00:14:42,389 --> 00:14:40,000
know that they overran and destroyed so

394
00:14:44,310 --> 00:14:42,399
much of the world and strangle holded

395
00:14:45,350 --> 00:14:44,320
everyone into their belief structure at

396
00:14:48,310 --> 00:14:45,360
one point

397
00:14:50,550 --> 00:14:48,320
scandinavia included especially i mean

398
00:14:53,189 --> 00:14:50,560
so i don't know we'd have to really dig

399
00:14:55,350 --> 00:14:53,199
into the historical aspect of it but

400
00:14:57,350 --> 00:14:55,360
along with the saga saying that this

401
00:15:00,310 --> 00:14:57,360
family took off and hid all of its

402
00:15:03,189 --> 00:15:00,320
treasures and this area of the world was

403
00:15:05,590 --> 00:15:03,199
destroyed by catholics

404
00:15:07,269 --> 00:15:05,600
does in a way fit with the historical

405
00:15:10,150 --> 00:15:07,279
narrative doesn't mean heathens and

406
00:15:11,670 --> 00:15:10,160
pagans are the good guys i don't think

407
00:15:13,350 --> 00:15:11,680
any of these people are the good guys

408
00:15:15,590 --> 00:15:13,360
because i tend to say

409
00:15:17,430 --> 00:15:15,600
the society wants you to lean on one

410
00:15:18,949 --> 00:15:17,440
wall or the other because it's easy to

411
00:15:20,790 --> 00:15:18,959
do that but the problem is we're

412
00:15:22,870 --> 00:15:20,800
supposed to be finding our own invisible

413
00:15:25,590 --> 00:15:22,880
balance beam that there's good ideas on

414
00:15:27,829 --> 00:15:25,600
both sides of this divide and conquer

415
00:15:29,829 --> 00:15:27,839
[\h__\h] that's been put in our faces if

416
00:15:31,350 --> 00:15:29,839
that makes sense

417
00:15:34,470 --> 00:15:31,360
the problem i have with that is i think

418
00:15:36,710 --> 00:15:34,480
if you run the catholic timeline i don't

419
00:15:38,790 --> 00:15:36,720
think it matches up with anything i've

420
00:15:41,590 --> 00:15:38,800
heard with the box saga i mean the

421
00:15:44,069 --> 00:15:41,600
catholics were pretty good at recording

422
00:15:45,990 --> 00:15:44,079
their timeline and all the popes and all

423
00:15:48,470 --> 00:15:46,000
the writings and all the bishops and all

424
00:15:49,670 --> 00:15:48,480
the phony baloney [\h__\h] that they

425
00:15:53,509 --> 00:15:49,680
were doing

426
00:15:55,509 --> 00:15:53,519
and you can match that right up to uh to

427
00:15:57,829 --> 00:15:55,519
the box saga and it doesn't it doesn't i

428
00:16:00,069 --> 00:15:57,839
mean it doesn't even

429
00:16:02,069 --> 00:16:00,079
are we talking about the uh invasion of

430
00:16:03,990 --> 00:16:02,079
uh finland and stuff like that the dates

431
00:16:05,829 --> 00:16:04,000
are are off

432
00:16:07,430 --> 00:16:05,839
i noticed that as well i did it

433
00:16:09,430 --> 00:16:07,440
considerably so

434
00:16:12,230 --> 00:16:09,440
and it's and it's and then you have all

435
00:16:13,910 --> 00:16:12,240
this different you know

436
00:16:15,990 --> 00:16:13,920
i was just talking to

437
00:16:18,629 --> 00:16:16,000
my buddy al borealis who runs forum

438
00:16:21,110 --> 00:16:18,639
borealis and he's yes

439
00:16:24,069 --> 00:16:21,120
good guy and he lives way up in far

440
00:16:26,949 --> 00:16:24,079
norway and uh he was

441
00:16:29,430 --> 00:16:26,959
chatting with somebody about the norse

442
00:16:31,189 --> 00:16:29,440
mythology and the norse

443
00:16:33,430 --> 00:16:31,199
religion culture and stuff like that and

444
00:16:35,030 --> 00:16:33,440
he was kind of laying a bunch of stuff

445
00:16:36,310 --> 00:16:35,040
because he's really studied it you know

446
00:16:38,310 --> 00:16:36,320
it's kind of second nature to him but

447
00:16:40,470 --> 00:16:38,320
he's kind of like okay you don't get it

448
00:16:42,790 --> 00:16:40,480
you know it's like number one

449
00:16:44,310 --> 00:16:42,800
there is nothing in

450
00:16:46,150 --> 00:16:44,320
left in

451
00:16:49,110 --> 00:16:46,160
norway because as you said you know

452
00:16:51,910 --> 00:16:49,120
there's this kind of cleansing uh it it

453
00:16:54,310 --> 00:16:51,920
but it's not just catholic and then some

454
00:16:57,350 --> 00:16:54,320
of them go over to ireland and scotland

455
00:16:59,829 --> 00:16:57,360
and that but iceland is most you know uh

456
00:17:02,069 --> 00:16:59,839
preserved of that kind of thing so once

457
00:17:05,029 --> 00:17:02,079
you start really breaking that down with

458
00:17:07,990 --> 00:17:05,039
scholars the box eye has some huge holes

459
00:17:10,630 --> 00:17:08,000
in it that i to me are irrecoverable

460
00:17:13,270 --> 00:17:10,640
that you just can't apply when the

461
00:17:15,350 --> 00:17:13,280
scholarship starts pulling it apart you

462
00:17:16,630 --> 00:17:15,360
can't start plugging the holes with just

463
00:17:19,189 --> 00:17:16,640
you know

464
00:17:21,350 --> 00:17:19,199
anecdote perhaps yeah right yeah or just

465
00:17:23,510 --> 00:17:21,360
or just uh you know i still like it you

466
00:17:24,870 --> 00:17:23,520
know because it doesn't it ring true but

467
00:17:26,309 --> 00:17:24,880
isn't because

468
00:17:28,309 --> 00:17:26,319
and this is really you know this

469
00:17:30,310 --> 00:17:28,319
conversation we're having right now is

470
00:17:33,350 --> 00:17:30,320
what's kind of

471
00:17:37,430 --> 00:17:33,360
really motivating me pushing me in terms

472
00:17:39,029 --> 00:17:37,440
of the us as a community as truth

473
00:17:41,350 --> 00:17:39,039
seekers you know

474
00:17:44,070 --> 00:17:41,360
oh i i still think we've lost our way in

475
00:17:46,870 --> 00:17:44,080
so many ways you know lost our way and

476
00:17:48,950 --> 00:17:46,880
and have fallen into you know kind of

477
00:17:50,710 --> 00:17:48,960
flatter science you know that's okay you

478
00:17:52,870 --> 00:17:50,720
know hey everyone has an opinion you

479
00:17:56,070 --> 00:17:52,880
know i won't i i've been on a guy's show

480
00:17:58,470 --> 00:17:56,080
where i'm like look it's [\h__\h] right

481
00:18:00,789 --> 00:17:58,480
you don't really believe in flat earth

482
00:18:02,630 --> 00:18:00,799
you know i've been on multiple shows

483
00:18:04,630 --> 00:18:02,640
where it's like okay

484
00:18:06,789 --> 00:18:04,640
you want to keep the options open number

485
00:18:08,150 --> 00:18:06,799
one why do you want to keep the options

486
00:18:09,990 --> 00:18:08,160
open and it goes back to the first thing

487
00:18:12,150 --> 00:18:10,000
i was saying andy like

488
00:18:15,029 --> 00:18:12,160
i do not want to

489
00:18:16,070 --> 00:18:15,039
piss you off so bad that like you're

490
00:18:18,470 --> 00:18:16,080
like

491
00:18:20,630 --> 00:18:18,480
[\h__\h] that alex security

492
00:18:21,590 --> 00:18:20,640
you know what seriously but

493
00:18:23,510 --> 00:18:21,600
because

494
00:18:24,630 --> 00:18:23,520
here the here are the two

495
00:18:25,909 --> 00:18:24,640
kind of

496
00:18:27,510 --> 00:18:25,919
like you're saying walls that we're

497
00:18:28,390 --> 00:18:27,520
leaning on

498
00:18:32,070 --> 00:18:28,400
one

499
00:18:33,590 --> 00:18:32,080
is when your uncle jerry comes to

500
00:18:36,710 --> 00:18:33,600
thanksgiving

501
00:18:39,990 --> 00:18:36,720
you've learned man you just go you talk

502
00:18:42,470 --> 00:18:40,000
about the weather you talk about

503
00:18:45,110 --> 00:18:42,480
fishing you know you just don't talk

504
00:18:47,590 --> 00:18:45,120
about this stuff with right it's going

505
00:18:49,990 --> 00:18:47,600
nowhere it's just gonna ruin your night

506
00:18:51,669 --> 00:18:50,000
too you didn't get any information into

507
00:18:53,110 --> 00:18:51,679
any brains that were gonna hear it the

508
00:18:55,830 --> 00:18:53,120
right way

509
00:18:59,590 --> 00:18:55,840
that's on one level and on the other

510
00:19:02,150 --> 00:18:59,600
level is if we really were like in the

511
00:19:04,310 --> 00:19:02,160
real world like long time friends for

512
00:19:05,750 --> 00:19:04,320
the longest time and had hung out and

513
00:19:07,430 --> 00:19:05,760
had done things and i could totally

514
00:19:08,830 --> 00:19:07,440
trust you and you could totally trust me

515
00:19:11,510 --> 00:19:08,840
and then we could have this kind of

516
00:19:12,950 --> 00:19:11,520
conversation kind of massachusetts style

517
00:19:15,110 --> 00:19:12,960
where we're just throwing down and going

518
00:19:16,950 --> 00:19:15,120
come on bro you know that's a bunch of

519
00:19:18,789 --> 00:19:16,960
well you know that's right yeah well you

520
00:19:20,549 --> 00:19:18,799
you got your [\h__\h] too you know this and

521
00:19:23,270 --> 00:19:20,559
that and then at the end we could just

522
00:19:24,789 --> 00:19:23,280
you know like okay get on with it you

523
00:19:26,870 --> 00:19:24,799
know right but

524
00:19:28,950 --> 00:19:26,880
that those are the two

525
00:19:30,870 --> 00:19:28,960
extremes i think

526
00:19:31,750 --> 00:19:30,880
i definitely want to be on the second

527
00:19:34,630 --> 00:19:31,760
one

528
00:19:36,789 --> 00:19:34,640
and but i understand the practical part

529
00:19:39,830 --> 00:19:36,799
of you know talking to somebody we've

530
00:19:40,549 --> 00:19:39,840
never met before how do you get there

531
00:19:42,950 --> 00:19:40,559
and

532
00:19:45,350 --> 00:19:42,960
or worse yet you know we're kind of

533
00:19:46,789 --> 00:19:45,360
letting our guard down as you said worse

534
00:19:49,669 --> 00:19:46,799
yeah you schedule an interview with

535
00:19:51,669 --> 00:19:49,679
someone they've written a book or they

536
00:19:54,549 --> 00:19:51,679
have a presence they're coming on your

537
00:19:57,350 --> 00:19:54,559
show they do not want to hear

538
00:19:58,950 --> 00:19:57,360
you know andy ripping them apart it just

539
00:20:03,830 --> 00:19:58,960
doesn't

540
00:20:06,070 --> 00:20:03,840
and it's it's also like um i said this

541
00:20:07,990 --> 00:20:06,080
on twitter the other day about the saga

542
00:20:11,029 --> 00:20:08,000
because again i don't hold it to be true

543
00:20:12,710 --> 00:20:11,039
i am very much like you where it's

544
00:20:15,110 --> 00:20:12,720
i like to be open i leave i like to

545
00:20:17,990 --> 00:20:15,120
leave some some wiggle room here to just

546
00:20:20,950 --> 00:20:18,000
pull out pieces of everybody's story and

547
00:20:22,549 --> 00:20:20,960
see where they went wrong or where some

548
00:20:24,149 --> 00:20:22,559
truth might lie or something like that

549
00:20:27,190 --> 00:20:24,159
but i said the other day about the saga

550
00:20:29,350 --> 00:20:27,200
like i i want to have some like really

551
00:20:32,870 --> 00:20:29,360
intense researchers on that i really

552
00:20:34,149 --> 00:20:32,880
respect and be able to be like hey sorry

553
00:20:36,310 --> 00:20:34,159
i don't want to talk about anything

554
00:20:38,470 --> 00:20:36,320
you're working on right now can i use

555
00:20:40,390 --> 00:20:38,480
your brain for two hours and it's like

556
00:20:42,630 --> 00:20:40,400
you can't really do that with someone

557
00:20:44,470 --> 00:20:42,640
you've never met you know maybe after

558
00:20:46,870 --> 00:20:44,480
like five appearances or something like

559
00:20:49,190 --> 00:20:46,880
hey can you help me out man can you take

560
00:20:51,029 --> 00:20:49,200
a look at this for me but even then it's

561
00:20:53,990 --> 00:20:51,039
hard because everybody's very busy and

562
00:20:55,110 --> 00:20:54,000
everybody's in their own silos kind of

563
00:20:56,789 --> 00:20:55,120
you know

564
00:20:59,029 --> 00:20:56,799
it's good to get out of the silo every

565
00:21:01,430 --> 00:20:59,039
once in a while but we always kind of

566
00:21:03,270 --> 00:21:01,440
cycle back in every once in a while

567
00:21:05,669 --> 00:21:03,280
well there's a reason why we're while

568
00:21:07,669 --> 00:21:05,679
we're in the silo and it's sometimes

569
00:21:08,950 --> 00:21:07,679
it's a good reason i mean the reason why

570
00:21:13,590 --> 00:21:08,960
we're in

571
00:21:16,149 --> 00:21:13,600
spirituality and in terms of

572
00:21:17,270 --> 00:21:16,159
extended consciousness and what that

573
00:21:19,669 --> 00:21:17,280
means

574
00:21:22,149 --> 00:21:19,679
is because we think there are some

575
00:21:23,830 --> 00:21:22,159
truths there that really kind of drive

576
00:21:25,909 --> 00:21:23,840
us forward in our life you know what i

577
00:21:28,310 --> 00:21:25,919
mean and people who are shut down from

578
00:21:29,430 --> 00:21:28,320
that or in a different silo you kind of

579
00:21:31,270 --> 00:21:29,440
want to

580
00:21:33,750 --> 00:21:31,280
knock on their little glass window and

581
00:21:36,470 --> 00:21:33,760
go come on out there's this whole other

582
00:21:38,789 --> 00:21:36,480
thing because you will die and you will

583
00:21:40,470 --> 00:21:38,799
face whether or not there is anything

584
00:21:42,310 --> 00:21:40,480
after that and what that is and what

585
00:21:44,870 --> 00:21:42,320
that means and what that could have

586
00:21:46,789 --> 00:21:44,880
meant in terms of how you live your life

587
00:21:49,669 --> 00:21:46,799
yeah i like the way you put that total

588
00:21:50,789 --> 00:21:49,679
regret or total jubilation perhaps one

589
00:21:52,950 --> 00:21:50,799
of the other

590
00:21:55,270 --> 00:21:52,960
that ending circumstance that you you

591
00:21:57,990 --> 00:21:55,280
know i go down that pathway a lot well

592
00:21:59,909 --> 00:21:58,000
an interesting way to bridge from this

593
00:22:01,750 --> 00:21:59,919
box saga little tangent we went down

594
00:22:03,110 --> 00:22:01,760
into what we were really going to kind

595
00:22:05,430 --> 00:22:03,120
of get into

596
00:22:07,750 --> 00:22:05,440
was the reason that what resonates with

597
00:22:10,070 --> 00:22:07,760
me most about that saga is just the

598
00:22:12,950 --> 00:22:10,080
language because of a psychedelic

599
00:22:14,870 --> 00:22:12,960
experience i had long time ago that i

600
00:22:16,549 --> 00:22:14,880
came out of and everybody even my

601
00:22:18,710 --> 00:22:16,559
friends tripping with me thought i was

602
00:22:20,390 --> 00:22:18,720
completely crazy and then i just forgot

603
00:22:22,950 --> 00:22:20,400
about it after a while but this saga

604
00:22:24,870 --> 00:22:22,960
reinvigorated the memory of coming out

605
00:22:26,390 --> 00:22:24,880
of an experience going

606
00:22:29,590 --> 00:22:26,400
there's a hidden

607
00:22:32,390 --> 00:22:29,600
language inside of every

608
00:22:35,510 --> 00:22:32,400
modern language there's some sort of

609
00:22:37,909 --> 00:22:35,520
phonetic connection that tells a sacred

610
00:22:40,149 --> 00:22:37,919
story that exists inside every one of us

611
00:22:41,909 --> 00:22:40,159
and then i found joseph campbell and the

612
00:22:42,630 --> 00:22:41,919
hero with a thousand faces and i was

613
00:22:43,750 --> 00:22:42,640
like

614
00:22:47,909 --> 00:22:43,760
this

615
00:22:51,350 --> 00:22:47,919
puzzle piece talking about the same

616
00:22:53,750 --> 00:22:51,360
thing like holy crap there's this

617
00:22:55,909 --> 00:22:53,760
story that exists inside of you know it

618
00:22:58,710 --> 00:22:55,919
was just that's what resonated with me

619
00:23:01,190 --> 00:22:58,720
so not that a lot of the factoids about

620
00:23:03,350 --> 00:23:01,200
saga necessarily have to be true but

621
00:23:07,029 --> 00:23:03,360
that something there resonates with my

622
00:23:10,630 --> 00:23:08,630
yeah although

623
00:23:13,430 --> 00:23:10,640
i tell you man i i would encourage you

624
00:23:14,950 --> 00:23:13,440
to kind of not tail off at the end there

625
00:23:17,190 --> 00:23:14,960
because i don't think it's necessarily

626
00:23:20,070 --> 00:23:17,200
about your your spirit there i think

627
00:23:20,830 --> 00:23:20,080
what you're saying is it connects to

628
00:23:24,549 --> 00:23:20,840
an

629
00:23:27,110 --> 00:23:24,559
experiential truth that you had in this

630
00:23:28,470 --> 00:23:27,120
extended realm so you know that's so

631
00:23:29,750 --> 00:23:28,480
that's been my

632
00:23:31,430 --> 00:23:29,760
kind of

633
00:23:32,710 --> 00:23:31,440
mission you know and it's what not a

634
00:23:35,029 --> 00:23:32,720
it's like a personal mission of

635
00:23:36,950 --> 00:23:35,039
discovery like so the first thing is

636
00:23:38,549 --> 00:23:36,960
does consciousness exist

637
00:23:40,710 --> 00:23:38,559
because you gotta

638
00:23:42,470 --> 00:23:40,720
is there's that little voice inside your

639
00:23:43,590 --> 00:23:42,480
head is that real and like i always

640
00:23:44,950 --> 00:23:43,600
point this out to people because i

641
00:23:48,310 --> 00:23:44,960
started this a long time ago in the

642
00:23:50,549 --> 00:23:48,320
popular the most popular it still is the

643
00:23:54,070 --> 00:23:50,559
predominant paradigm in science is that

644
00:23:56,230 --> 00:23:54,080
no that is an illusion that is not real

645
00:23:58,230 --> 00:23:56,240
that is an epiphenomenon your brain your

646
00:23:59,669 --> 00:23:58,240
brain is just this ball of jelly up

647
00:24:02,070 --> 00:23:59,679
there and it does this thing and you

648
00:24:05,269 --> 00:24:02,080
think that story is real but it's not

649
00:24:08,070 --> 00:24:05,279
that has been falsified scientifically

650
00:24:10,950 --> 00:24:08,080
and we talked 40 hours on that yeah but

651
00:24:12,230 --> 00:24:10,960
the next point that gets us to your

652
00:24:13,990 --> 00:24:12,240
thing

653
00:24:17,669 --> 00:24:14,000
so now we're saying

654
00:24:19,990 --> 00:24:17,679
not only is there this consciousness

655
00:24:22,789 --> 00:24:20,000
not only is that story that voice inside

656
00:24:26,230 --> 00:24:22,799
your head not only is that real

657
00:24:28,870 --> 00:24:26,240
but the voice can be outside your head

658
00:24:31,510 --> 00:24:28,880
and that can be real there is some kind

659
00:24:33,029 --> 00:24:31,520
of extended consciousness that we always

660
00:24:35,269 --> 00:24:33,039
know when we're talking about angels and

661
00:24:36,630 --> 00:24:35,279
demons or for christian or whatever we

662
00:24:37,990 --> 00:24:36,640
always know there's this extent of

663
00:24:40,549 --> 00:24:38,000
consciousness

664
00:24:41,909 --> 00:24:40,559
but we weren't allowed to talk about it

665
00:24:44,630 --> 00:24:41,919
and part of the part of the way they

666
00:24:46,630 --> 00:24:44,640
muscled us is because they denied even

667
00:24:48,630 --> 00:24:46,640
consciousness they even said even the

668
00:24:51,029 --> 00:24:48,640
voice inside your head

669
00:24:53,350 --> 00:24:51,039
isn't real and now you're going whoa

670
00:24:55,909 --> 00:24:53,360
andy you're telling me that you had some

671
00:24:58,950 --> 00:24:55,919
experience outside of your body and

672
00:25:02,310 --> 00:24:58,960
that's real and that's an experience oh

673
00:25:03,110 --> 00:25:02,320
andy you are so stupid yeah right

674
00:25:07,590 --> 00:25:03,120
so

675
00:25:09,590 --> 00:25:07,600
kind of poking you a little bit in terms

676
00:25:12,390 --> 00:25:09,600
of tailing off and saying you know

677
00:25:15,830 --> 00:25:12,400
maybe it resonated me in it no man you

678
00:25:20,230 --> 00:25:15,840
had a maybe let's consider the opposite

679
00:25:21,669 --> 00:25:20,240
andy had a direct experience of knowing

680
00:25:23,510 --> 00:25:21,679
some super

681
00:25:25,990 --> 00:25:23,520
like advanced

682
00:25:28,230 --> 00:25:26,000
knowledge that is out there in some

683
00:25:29,830 --> 00:25:28,240
other realm and you pulled that

684
00:25:30,789 --> 00:25:29,840
knowledge back

685
00:25:32,710 --> 00:25:30,799
and

686
00:25:34,789 --> 00:25:32,720
then that knowledge resonated with

687
00:25:36,549 --> 00:25:34,799
something else that you came across

688
00:25:38,149 --> 00:25:36,559
whether that is

689
00:25:40,470 --> 00:25:38,159
literally true or not in terms of the

690
00:25:41,909 --> 00:25:40,480
box saga is another question but that's

691
00:25:43,830 --> 00:25:41,919
how you get what i'm saying you get this

692
00:25:46,710 --> 00:25:43,840
yes it doesn't have to even match up

693
00:25:48,470 --> 00:25:46,720
directly it just it's it relates it

694
00:25:50,870 --> 00:25:48,480
directly relates it's almost like a

695
00:25:53,269 --> 00:25:50,880
reflection in the external world from an

696
00:25:54,710 --> 00:25:53,279
internal experience and honestly you hit

697
00:25:56,390 --> 00:25:54,720
on a great point there because i've

698
00:25:58,230 --> 00:25:56,400
heard many people and i resonate with

699
00:26:00,549 --> 00:25:58,240
this that when they have psychedelic

700
00:26:01,990 --> 00:26:00,559
experiences or near-death experiences

701
00:26:04,470 --> 00:26:02,000
it's almo it almost feels like they're

702
00:26:07,190 --> 00:26:04,480
given this internal map or this internal

703
00:26:09,830 --> 00:26:07,200
puzzle and they want to

704
00:26:12,870 --> 00:26:09,840
find all the pieces out here that match

705
00:26:14,710 --> 00:26:12,880
up with that internal puzzle and

706
00:26:17,669 --> 00:26:14,720
it seems to be

707
00:26:19,990 --> 00:26:17,679
uh available it seems to work like

708
00:26:22,310 --> 00:26:20,000
putting the solution first and then

709
00:26:24,470 --> 00:26:22,320
finding the parts that get there it's

710
00:26:25,830 --> 00:26:24,480
incredible you know but again that can

711
00:26:27,909 --> 00:26:25,840
lead to

712
00:26:30,230 --> 00:26:27,919
you know bad thinking too because you

713
00:26:33,350 --> 00:26:30,240
can get hung up on a thought and want to

714
00:26:35,510 --> 00:26:33,360
prove it more than it should be proven

715
00:26:37,430 --> 00:26:35,520
absolutely great point great pun i love

716
00:26:39,430 --> 00:26:37,440
the ping pong back and forth it's gotta

717
00:26:41,350 --> 00:26:39,440
be both man it unfortunately it has to

718
00:26:42,789 --> 00:26:41,360
be both it's those two leaning sides

719
00:26:45,669 --> 00:26:42,799
right

720
00:26:48,630 --> 00:26:45,679
exactly and you know so here's here's

721
00:26:49,909 --> 00:26:48,640
another you know uh ping pong paradigm

722
00:26:53,269 --> 00:26:49,919
flip

723
00:26:54,070 --> 00:26:53,279
is that extended consciousness realm

724
00:26:57,269 --> 00:26:54,080
more

725
00:26:59,029 --> 00:26:57,279
real whatever that means real than this

726
00:27:00,390 --> 00:26:59,039
realm right because immediately you're

727
00:27:02,870 --> 00:27:00,400
nodding your head because you're like

728
00:27:04,470 --> 00:27:02,880
yeah that's what we keep hearing yeah

729
00:27:07,029 --> 00:27:04,480
you talk to anyone who's had a

730
00:27:10,390 --> 00:27:07,039
near-death experience overwhelmingly

731
00:27:13,990 --> 00:27:10,400
like 90 percent off the charts

732
00:27:15,510 --> 00:27:14,000
this is real this is home you're living

733
00:27:21,430 --> 00:27:15,520
the illusion

734
00:27:24,389 --> 00:27:21,440
that was real out-of-body experience uh

735
00:27:26,230 --> 00:27:24,399
all sorts of different experiences e.t

736
00:27:28,710 --> 00:27:26,240
you know what does that mean when people

737
00:27:29,990 --> 00:27:28,720
have that experience they go okay you

738
00:27:31,510 --> 00:27:30,000
know this is

739
00:27:38,149 --> 00:27:31,520
so

740
00:27:39,350 --> 00:27:38,159
this extended consciousness experience

741
00:27:41,830 --> 00:27:39,360
like you did

742
00:27:44,149 --> 00:27:41,840
it's profound

743
00:27:45,990 --> 00:27:44,159
and it's true in a way that you just

744
00:27:47,430 --> 00:27:46,000
knew it in your you can't say in your

745
00:27:50,230 --> 00:27:47,440
bones because you're out of your body

746
00:27:52,549 --> 00:27:50,240
right you knew it it you know soul level

747
00:27:54,789 --> 00:27:52,559
and now you're coming back and now

748
00:27:56,310 --> 00:27:54,799
you're trying to rationalize it just

749
00:27:59,909 --> 00:27:56,320
like you said you're trying to fit those

750
00:28:00,830 --> 00:27:59,919
pieces together in an inferior

751
00:28:02,310 --> 00:28:00,840
form

752
00:28:04,950 --> 00:28:02,320
yes so

753
00:28:07,350 --> 00:28:04,960
we're coming back from the uh i like to

754
00:28:10,470 --> 00:28:07,360
say it's like the the uh

755
00:28:12,070 --> 00:28:10,480
ecstatic experience of non-ego or

756
00:28:13,909 --> 00:28:12,080
something along those lines and we're

757
00:28:16,470 --> 00:28:13,919
coming back and we're explaining it to

758
00:28:18,149 --> 00:28:16,480
everybody and sharing those experiences

759
00:28:20,630 --> 00:28:18,159
with our egoic

760
00:28:23,830 --> 00:28:20,640
conscious linear mind so we have this

761
00:28:25,590 --> 00:28:23,840
feeling of non-linearity and all that

762
00:28:27,669 --> 00:28:25,600
and then you come back in and the only

763
00:28:28,950 --> 00:28:27,679
way you can describe it is using this

764
00:28:32,789 --> 00:28:28,960
inferior

765
00:28:35,909 --> 00:28:32,799
uh reduced form as i would say it's like

766
00:28:37,110 --> 00:28:35,919
a reduced form i think illusion is a

767
00:28:39,350 --> 00:28:37,120
is um

768
00:28:40,630 --> 00:28:39,360
it can be a dangerous term i i wouldn't

769
00:28:41,510 --> 00:28:40,640
wonder if you would agree with that

770
00:28:42,710 --> 00:28:41,520
because

771
00:28:44,389 --> 00:28:42,720
um

772
00:28:47,430 --> 00:28:44,399
you know again trying to find that

773
00:28:49,430 --> 00:28:47,440
middle path always um

774
00:28:51,750 --> 00:28:49,440
there's a way to

775
00:28:54,789 --> 00:28:51,760
get spiritual and then get carried off

776
00:28:57,029 --> 00:28:54,799
by certain people's ideas that kind of

777
00:28:59,190 --> 00:28:57,039
say the body is meaningless it's just

778
00:29:02,070 --> 00:28:59,200
this spirit this inner gnosis that

779
00:29:04,470 --> 00:29:02,080
matters where i go more into the

780
00:29:05,669 --> 00:29:04,480
alchemical explanation of things like

781
00:29:07,590 --> 00:29:05,679
for instance

782
00:29:08,870 --> 00:29:07,600
those people you mentioned in science

783
00:29:10,950 --> 00:29:08,880
like neil degrasse tyson all these

784
00:29:13,750 --> 00:29:10,960
people that we used to kind of

785
00:29:15,909 --> 00:29:13,760
accept i did blindly like 20 years ago

786
00:29:17,510 --> 00:29:15,919
for sure i loved all of those guys

787
00:29:19,830 --> 00:29:17,520
they're it's like they're looking at a

788
00:29:21,269 --> 00:29:19,840
model of reality and going yeah see

789
00:29:22,630 --> 00:29:21,279
clearly this is how it works and it's

790
00:29:24,950 --> 00:29:22,640
like dude that's made out of legos

791
00:29:26,070 --> 00:29:24,960
that's not the real thing if that does

792
00:29:28,310 --> 00:29:26,080
that make sense to you does that

793
00:29:29,110 --> 00:29:28,320
resonate yeah that's great

794
00:29:30,230 --> 00:29:29,120
and

795
00:29:32,789 --> 00:29:30,240
yeah

796
00:29:34,230 --> 00:29:32,799
where i was going with that but it's

797
00:29:35,350 --> 00:29:34,240
just

798
00:29:38,310 --> 00:29:35,360
it uh

799
00:29:41,190 --> 00:29:38,320
yeah it feels like um we're kind of

800
00:29:43,350 --> 00:29:41,200
reduced here but it's not that it's fake

801
00:29:45,190 --> 00:29:43,360
it's not that it's an illusion i think

802
00:29:46,750 --> 00:29:45,200
even the word maya in buddhism and

803
00:29:49,110 --> 00:29:46,760
hinduism has been

804
00:29:52,070 --> 00:29:49,120
misappropriated to illusion when it

805
00:29:55,510 --> 00:29:52,080
really represents uh the appearance of

806
00:29:58,149 --> 00:29:55,520
what is real so it's you know let me

807
00:30:00,789 --> 00:29:58,159
quote from andy and his answer to my

808
00:30:01,830 --> 00:30:00,799
survey question consciousness again this

809
00:30:04,470 --> 00:30:01,840
is really

810
00:30:06,230 --> 00:30:04,480
it's it's short but it's really uh very

811
00:30:08,389 --> 00:30:06,240
profound i don't want to play i don't

812
00:30:11,350 --> 00:30:08,399
love too much smoke everything is

813
00:30:15,110 --> 00:30:11,360
consciousness and then what you added is

814
00:30:17,990 --> 00:30:15,120
the paradox somehow allows this

815
00:30:21,830 --> 00:30:18,000
experience to me that is exactly what

816
00:30:24,549 --> 00:30:21,840
you just said there yeah alchemical

817
00:30:27,029 --> 00:30:24,559
opposites and creating this third what

818
00:30:29,590 --> 00:30:27,039
what is this why are we here what's

819
00:30:31,110 --> 00:30:29,600
happening right now do we hold on to it

820
00:30:32,950 --> 00:30:31,120
what do we do

821
00:30:33,990 --> 00:30:32,960
poof

822
00:30:36,230 --> 00:30:34,000
i don't know

823
00:30:38,310 --> 00:30:36,240
and i yeah and not to cut you off it uh

824
00:30:39,350 --> 00:30:38,320
it's given me a lot of stress

825
00:30:42,630 --> 00:30:39,360
about

826
00:30:44,630 --> 00:30:42,640
afterlife honestly and i love symbolism

827
00:30:46,549 --> 00:30:44,640
and i love ancient religions and looking

828
00:30:47,830 --> 00:30:46,559
at all the comparisons and

829
00:30:48,789 --> 00:30:47,840
how they're different and how they're

830
00:30:50,789 --> 00:30:48,799
similar

831
00:30:53,990 --> 00:30:50,799
but i often wonder are they ever really

832
00:30:55,830 --> 00:30:54,000
talking about beyond conscious life

833
00:30:58,630 --> 00:30:55,840
are they talking about what's missing

834
00:31:00,870 --> 00:30:58,640
from our perception right now

835
00:31:03,269 --> 00:31:00,880
that you know what i mean heaven here

836
00:31:06,310 --> 00:31:03,279
because on psychedelics especially i see

837
00:31:07,830 --> 00:31:06,320
my my desk i see my computer but much

838
00:31:09,830 --> 00:31:07,840
like that psychedelic art that's just

839
00:31:12,310 --> 00:31:09,840
been around forever there's like more

840
00:31:14,389 --> 00:31:12,320
layers to it and it's beautiful and

841
00:31:15,750 --> 00:31:14,399
there's majesties everywhere but it's

842
00:31:17,909 --> 00:31:15,760
not that it's anything different than

843
00:31:18,710 --> 00:31:17,919
what i'm seeing i'm just seeing all of

844
00:31:20,470 --> 00:31:18,720
it

845
00:31:22,870 --> 00:31:20,480
if that adds up

846
00:31:25,350 --> 00:31:22,880
well it does add up it's just how you're

847
00:31:27,509 --> 00:31:25,360
going to add it up so and here's here's

848
00:31:29,590 --> 00:31:27,519
a here's a pivot that i think is kind of

849
00:31:31,830 --> 00:31:29,600
really interesting so you take the

850
00:31:33,990 --> 00:31:31,840
psychedelic experience and it has all

851
00:31:36,230 --> 00:31:34,000
sorts of baggage associated with it and

852
00:31:38,230 --> 00:31:36,240
we all get that so pivot to the

853
00:31:40,549 --> 00:31:38,240
near-death experience and let's see what

854
00:31:43,110 --> 00:31:40,559
that looks like compared to that because

855
00:31:45,269 --> 00:31:43,120
i think the parallels are just

856
00:31:47,669 --> 00:31:45,279
stunning so people have near-death

857
00:31:48,549 --> 00:31:47,679
experiences and as we know

858
00:31:50,909 --> 00:31:48,559
they

859
00:31:54,470 --> 00:31:50,919
the variety of these are just

860
00:31:56,549 --> 00:31:54,480
unexplainable and their weirdness is

861
00:31:58,630 --> 00:31:56,559
unexplainable and in some ways would

862
00:32:01,029 --> 00:31:58,640
seem to be irresolvable in the same way

863
00:32:03,190 --> 00:32:01,039
that psychedelic experiences are oh i

864
00:32:04,470 --> 00:32:03,200
saw this man i saw that well i saw this

865
00:32:05,669 --> 00:32:04,480
you know and like then we're going to

866
00:32:07,830 --> 00:32:05,679
try and

867
00:32:10,950 --> 00:32:07,840
resolve those at some physical level

868
00:32:13,350 --> 00:32:10,960
well that means that there's 17 million

869
00:32:15,509 --> 00:32:13,360
layers to reality and it's like when i

870
00:32:17,110 --> 00:32:15,519
hear that stuff it's like

871
00:32:19,269 --> 00:32:17,120
here's here's a guy he interviewed from

872
00:32:21,190 --> 00:32:19,279
a near-death experience

873
00:32:22,950 --> 00:32:21,200
loved guy great guy his name is david

874
00:32:25,590 --> 00:32:22,960
ditchfield

875
00:32:28,470 --> 00:32:25,600
think about this british guy

876
00:32:30,070 --> 00:32:28,480
he's going to kiss his wife goodbye at

877
00:32:32,470 --> 00:32:30,080
the train

878
00:32:33,990 --> 00:32:32,480
he leans forward this is england so it's

879
00:32:35,509 --> 00:32:34,000
like massachusetts it's always raining

880
00:32:36,710 --> 00:32:35,519
it's always shitty weather except now

881
00:32:39,110 --> 00:32:36,720
you probably gotta go with her now

882
00:32:41,110 --> 00:32:39,120
sometimes it's humid as hell yeah

883
00:32:42,470 --> 00:32:41,120
he leads forward his coat gets caught in

884
00:32:45,350 --> 00:32:42,480
the doors

885
00:32:47,830 --> 00:32:45,360
and he is along for the ride as the

886
00:32:50,789 --> 00:32:47,840
train takes off he's thrown under the

887
00:32:52,789 --> 00:32:50,799
train the train rolls him over he dies

888
00:32:54,710 --> 00:32:52,799
common misconception about near-death

889
00:32:56,789 --> 00:32:54,720
experience and not a good use of the

890
00:32:59,990 --> 00:32:56,799
term because he is dead

891
00:33:02,789 --> 00:33:00,000
by any means that we're clinically

892
00:33:04,710 --> 00:33:02,799
talking about in terms of uh you know 50

893
00:33:06,149 --> 00:33:04,720
or 100 years ago

894
00:33:08,149 --> 00:33:06,159
when before we could do this

895
00:33:10,230 --> 00:33:08,159
resuscitation of being

896
00:33:12,389 --> 00:33:10,240
bring people back to death he's dead

897
00:33:14,710 --> 00:33:12,399
dead dead dead yes yes

898
00:33:16,789 --> 00:33:14,720
and he's dead for a while

899
00:33:18,549 --> 00:33:16,799
in his experience

900
00:33:20,230 --> 00:33:18,559
he meets jesus

901
00:33:23,430 --> 00:33:20,240
and he's very

902
00:33:24,470 --> 00:33:23,440
clear about the fact that he meets jesus

903
00:33:33,830 --> 00:33:24,480
he

904
00:33:35,909 --> 00:33:33,840
that after his near-death experience but

905
00:33:37,750 --> 00:33:35,919
he also develops these incredible

906
00:33:39,509 --> 00:33:37,760
artistic abilities i see you have a

907
00:33:42,070 --> 00:33:39,519
keyboard in the background yes this guy

908
00:33:44,549 --> 00:33:42,080
had this guy had no musical background

909
00:33:47,669 --> 00:33:44,559
all of a sudden he's

910
00:33:50,230 --> 00:33:47,679
you know writing symphonies and even had

911
00:33:52,789 --> 00:33:50,240
one performed you know at his thing

912
00:33:55,669 --> 00:33:52,799
drawing these art pieces these huge

913
00:33:57,350 --> 00:33:55,679
large-scale art pieces i'm not an art

914
00:33:59,269 --> 00:33:57,360
expert i can't tell you but they look

915
00:33:59,990 --> 00:33:59,279
pretty incredible to me i couldn't do

916
00:34:02,389 --> 00:34:00,000
them

917
00:34:04,470 --> 00:34:02,399
but jesus is a central part of his

918
00:34:07,269 --> 00:34:04,480
experience you know so i'm talking to

919
00:34:09,030 --> 00:34:07,279
him i'm saying david i get it a lot of

920
00:34:10,869 --> 00:34:09,040
people see jesus

921
00:34:14,149 --> 00:34:10,879
i gotta tell you if you look at it

922
00:34:16,629 --> 00:34:14,159
scientifically statistically

923
00:34:18,710 --> 00:34:16,639
not everybody sees jesus small

924
00:34:20,230 --> 00:34:18,720
percentage of people see jesus what are

925
00:34:22,629 --> 00:34:20,240
we to make of that

926
00:34:25,190 --> 00:34:22,639
all the other parts of their experience

927
00:34:29,109 --> 00:34:25,200
line up oneness love

928
00:34:30,710 --> 00:34:29,119
god connection all that lines up but

929
00:34:32,869 --> 00:34:30,720
some of them see buddha some of them

930
00:34:34,790 --> 00:34:32,879
just see light some of them see energy

931
00:34:37,349 --> 00:34:34,800
what do you make of that

932
00:34:39,909 --> 00:34:37,359
i'm pretty sure it's jesus you know and

933
00:34:41,669 --> 00:34:39,919
then i had this other kind of hypnotic

934
00:34:44,310 --> 00:34:41,679
regression and the woman who was

935
00:34:46,069 --> 00:34:44,320
regressing me said hey you were there

936
00:34:47,030 --> 00:34:46,079
with jesus

937
00:34:49,829 --> 00:34:47,040
okay

938
00:34:51,829 --> 00:34:49,839
i said how about this david i said i've

939
00:34:53,750 --> 00:34:51,839
interviewed a lot of people in with

940
00:34:56,629 --> 00:34:53,760
near-death experiences

941
00:34:58,310 --> 00:34:56,639
and some of them have told me

942
00:35:00,230 --> 00:34:58,320
it was jesus

943
00:35:01,910 --> 00:35:00,240
but then when they thought about it more

944
00:35:03,430 --> 00:35:01,920
and as they lived their life and some of

945
00:35:04,950 --> 00:35:03,440
them even had multiple near-death

946
00:35:07,589 --> 00:35:04,960
experiences

947
00:35:09,910 --> 00:35:07,599
they said yeah it was jesus but there

948
00:35:11,990 --> 00:35:09,920
was something more there was something

949
00:35:14,950 --> 00:35:12,000
more behind it

950
00:35:17,190 --> 00:35:14,960
and then he paused for a second he goes

951
00:35:19,510 --> 00:35:17,200
yeah i kind of get the sense that maybe

952
00:35:21,430 --> 00:35:19,520
there's something more so

953
00:35:24,230 --> 00:35:21,440
back to switch over to our

954
00:35:27,430 --> 00:35:24,240
hallucinogenic experience

955
00:35:29,190 --> 00:35:27,440
so you're presented with all these kind

956
00:35:33,349 --> 00:35:29,200
of things that

957
00:35:35,270 --> 00:35:33,359
i like if you're not experienced

958
00:35:37,270 --> 00:35:35,280
become the focus of it you know like all

959
00:35:40,230 --> 00:35:37,280
the lights and the colors and stuff yeah

960
00:35:41,910 --> 00:35:40,240
the illusions are still in here too yeah

961
00:35:43,270 --> 00:35:41,920
and and as you

962
00:35:45,349 --> 00:35:43,280
some of them aren't illusions because

963
00:35:47,990 --> 00:35:45,359
some of them are mixed in with like the

964
00:35:49,829 --> 00:35:48,000
deep knowing that you had right yes same

965
00:35:51,510 --> 00:35:49,839
for david you know same for david and

966
00:35:53,990 --> 00:35:51,520
when he came back with jesus he came

967
00:35:56,710 --> 00:35:54,000
back with some good [\h__\h] yeah damn right

968
00:35:59,430 --> 00:35:56,720
yeah but but maybe there's maybe there's

969
00:36:02,870 --> 00:35:59,440
more so that the trick there is back to

970
00:36:05,990 --> 00:36:02,880
what we're saying not being stuck in the

971
00:36:08,950 --> 00:36:06,000
narrative not being stuck in i've i've

972
00:36:11,430 --> 00:36:08,960
now experienced everything let me come

973
00:36:13,190 --> 00:36:11,440
back and proselytize and convert people

974
00:36:15,030 --> 00:36:13,200
into everything

975
00:36:16,790 --> 00:36:15,040
i love where we're going with this

976
00:36:18,870 --> 00:36:16,800
because it brought me to the thought of

977
00:36:21,349 --> 00:36:18,880
how um you know it's the inner to the

978
00:36:23,589 --> 00:36:21,359
outer the micro to the macro how we're

979
00:36:25,990 --> 00:36:23,599
describing an inner experience

980
00:36:27,109 --> 00:36:26,000
but we're also talking about society too

981
00:36:29,349 --> 00:36:27,119
because a lot of times when we're

982
00:36:31,990 --> 00:36:29,359
talking about conspiracy theories and

983
00:36:34,470 --> 00:36:32,000
what the elites do the big bad capital t

984
00:36:36,310 --> 00:36:34,480
they whatever that means

985
00:36:38,230 --> 00:36:36,320
it's always that well there's always

986
00:36:39,990 --> 00:36:38,240
truth mixed in with the lies and it's

987
00:36:42,310 --> 00:36:40,000
like well why does that keep reflecting

988
00:36:44,390 --> 00:36:42,320
consciousness's behavior you know when i

989
00:36:48,150 --> 00:36:44,400
had my psychedelic experiences i found

990
00:36:50,150 --> 00:36:48,160
the conspirator and it was me it was my

991
00:36:52,230 --> 00:36:50,160
surface level self it was my ego

992
00:36:54,390 --> 00:36:52,240
whatever you know discipline you you

993
00:36:56,710 --> 00:36:54,400
want to pull from it was that word it

994
00:36:58,710 --> 00:36:56,720
was that part of myself that couldn't

995
00:37:01,349 --> 00:36:58,720
face traumas that i dealt with so i

996
00:37:03,190 --> 00:37:01,359
created patterns and walls whatever

997
00:37:05,109 --> 00:37:03,200
but it seems like

998
00:37:07,190 --> 00:37:05,119
it's such a very

999
00:37:09,589 --> 00:37:07,200
you know conscious experience going on

1000
00:37:12,150 --> 00:37:09,599
here in the world when you see that kind

1001
00:37:14,550 --> 00:37:12,160
of as above so below

1002
00:37:16,390 --> 00:37:14,560
structure of everything that almost i

1003
00:37:19,030 --> 00:37:16,400
call it fractal i talk about fractal

1004
00:37:22,230 --> 00:37:19,040
geometry a lot because not only is that

1005
00:37:25,510 --> 00:37:22,240
a fan favorite of of the psychedelic

1006
00:37:27,910 --> 00:37:25,520
visual stimulus that occurs but along

1007
00:37:30,790 --> 00:37:27,920
with those visual cool hallucinations

1008
00:37:33,109 --> 00:37:30,800
comes a a gnosis of a deep philosophy

1009
00:37:33,990 --> 00:37:33,119
about reality and how everything seems

1010
00:37:36,630 --> 00:37:34,000
to be

1011
00:37:39,829 --> 00:37:36,640
fractal on some level that behind that

1012
00:37:42,950 --> 00:37:39,839
jesus or buddha there is this thing

1013
00:37:44,710 --> 00:37:42,960
that exists that is just self-similar on

1014
00:37:46,630 --> 00:37:44,720
every level and that's why people say

1015
00:37:49,510 --> 00:37:46,640
you know god is everywhere god is within

1016
00:37:51,190 --> 00:37:49,520
you or you can find god anywhere it's

1017
00:37:55,270 --> 00:37:51,200
why terence mckenna came back from a

1018
00:37:57,349 --> 00:37:55,280
psychedelic trip saying a song is a song

1019
00:37:59,510 --> 00:37:57,359
to us that made no sense and it didn't

1020
00:38:02,150 --> 00:37:59,520
have any profound impact on me when he

1021
00:38:03,589 --> 00:38:02,160
told it everybody laughs in the audience

1022
00:38:05,349 --> 00:38:03,599
because they get it that he's saying

1023
00:38:08,310 --> 00:38:05,359
that literally the truth is within

1024
00:38:10,630 --> 00:38:08,320
everything it's just it's fractal and it

1025
00:38:11,829 --> 00:38:10,640
it could mean a million different things

1026
00:38:14,230 --> 00:38:11,839
i don't know we kind of jumped around

1027
00:38:17,670 --> 00:38:14,240
there but

1028
00:38:20,390 --> 00:38:17,680
spot on here's the dilemma we face

1029
00:38:23,990 --> 00:38:20,400
the reality that you're probing so

1030
00:38:25,349 --> 00:38:24,000
deeply that few people are willing to go

1031
00:38:26,470 --> 00:38:25,359
here's where i was going to go with that

1032
00:38:28,950 --> 00:38:26,480
okay

1033
00:38:30,550 --> 00:38:28,960
the the truth mixed with the lie thing

1034
00:38:34,470 --> 00:38:30,560
that you said

1035
00:38:37,270 --> 00:38:34,480
hey if i'm a they and my job is [\h__\h]

1036
00:38:39,430 --> 00:38:37,280
socially engineering people and you want

1037
00:38:40,950 --> 00:38:39,440
me on that wall you need me on that wall

1038
00:38:44,390 --> 00:38:40,960
kind of thing which is

1039
00:38:46,470 --> 00:38:44,400
true too you know we we do live

1040
00:38:49,430 --> 00:38:46,480
under the red white and blue

1041
00:38:52,390 --> 00:38:49,440
and all the [\h__\h] that we've done we own

1042
00:38:54,470 --> 00:38:52,400
that to a certain extent and we own

1043
00:38:56,150 --> 00:38:54,480
and have to own and have to acknowledge

1044
00:38:59,589 --> 00:38:56,160
that people are doing

1045
00:39:03,109 --> 00:38:59,599
mean nasty horribly evil stuff in our

1046
00:39:05,349 --> 00:39:03,119
name yes those people have perfected

1047
00:39:08,150 --> 00:39:05,359
misinformation disinformation mixing

1048
00:39:11,510 --> 00:39:08,160
truth and lie bam that's a recipe for

1049
00:39:13,510 --> 00:39:11,520
what is most effective for to get this

1050
00:39:15,670 --> 00:39:13,520
group from a to b

1051
00:39:18,310 --> 00:39:15,680
i am reluctant

1052
00:39:20,870 --> 00:39:18,320
to connect that to

1053
00:39:22,790 --> 00:39:20,880
the deeper experience that you had i

1054
00:39:25,270 --> 00:39:22,800
understand that at some level it all has

1055
00:39:27,349 --> 00:39:25,280
to be connected but i'm reluctant to go

1056
00:39:30,630 --> 00:39:27,359
there because i hear what you're saying

1057
00:39:32,630 --> 00:39:30,640
on a spiritual level which is fantastic

1058
00:39:34,870 --> 00:39:32,640
because what i hear you saying is

1059
00:39:35,829 --> 00:39:34,880
as soon as i start pointing at someone

1060
00:39:37,510 --> 00:39:35,839
else

1061
00:39:39,349 --> 00:39:37,520
i need to do the old thing and look

1062
00:39:42,550 --> 00:39:39,359
about yes

1063
00:39:44,790 --> 00:39:42,560
how is that if i'm able to see that mean

1064
00:39:47,589 --> 00:39:44,800
nasty evil [\h__\h]

1065
00:39:49,829 --> 00:39:47,599
that means it's in me if i'm able to

1066
00:39:53,190 --> 00:39:49,839
process that dmt

1067
00:39:55,829 --> 00:39:53,200
that means that my body is

1068
00:39:57,829 --> 00:39:55,839
capable of processing otherwise it was a

1069
00:39:59,430 --> 00:39:57,839
total foreign substance nothing would

1070
00:40:02,069 --> 00:39:59,440
happen or something you know else would

1071
00:40:04,550 --> 00:40:02,079
happen so i but you get what i'm saying

1072
00:40:06,470 --> 00:40:04,560
i think i do i think i do so

1073
00:40:07,430 --> 00:40:06,480
let me let me try to rephrase under the

1074
00:40:11,190 --> 00:40:07,440
the

1075
00:40:14,069 --> 00:40:11,200
it's like

1076
00:40:16,870 --> 00:40:14,079
perhaps what i was experiencing and kind

1077
00:40:19,349 --> 00:40:16,880
of you know mirroring mirroring out to

1078
00:40:23,510 --> 00:40:19,359
the elites or whatever with my own inner

1079
00:40:25,670 --> 00:40:23,520
behavior is um is just simply the ego or

1080
00:40:27,589 --> 00:40:25,680
something it's the bad behavior that i

1081
00:40:29,910 --> 00:40:27,599
have which can

1082
00:40:31,910 --> 00:40:29,920
naturally be compared to the

1083
00:40:34,390 --> 00:40:31,920
macro of the bad behavior that is in

1084
00:40:35,589 --> 00:40:34,400
collective society

1085
00:40:38,390 --> 00:40:35,599
i was kind of saying i was kind of

1086
00:40:40,309 --> 00:40:38,400
saying something slightly different okay

1087
00:40:41,349 --> 00:40:40,319
well it's it's not contradictory it's

1088
00:40:43,589 --> 00:40:41,359
just that

1089
00:40:46,870 --> 00:40:43,599
as we're trying to navigate

1090
00:40:49,589 --> 00:40:46,880
this world this space and particularly

1091
00:40:51,270 --> 00:40:49,599
what we're trying to do you know

1092
00:40:53,829 --> 00:40:51,280
uh you and i

1093
00:40:55,829 --> 00:40:53,839
is we're trying to

1094
00:40:59,430 --> 00:40:55,839
live in these two worlds

1095
00:41:01,829 --> 00:40:59,440
and i'm saying that i don't think

1096
00:41:04,950 --> 00:41:01,839
right now i'm willing to

1097
00:41:06,870 --> 00:41:04,960
uh say that my feet aren't planted in

1098
00:41:08,790 --> 00:41:06,880
two worlds because that's how it seems

1099
00:41:11,190 --> 00:41:08,800
to me and the deeper spiritual

1100
00:41:13,829 --> 00:41:11,200
understandings you came to about truth

1101
00:41:17,190 --> 00:41:13,839
and lie i think are beautiful but i

1102
00:41:18,630 --> 00:41:17,200
think they are separate from

1103
00:41:23,030 --> 00:41:18,640
at least at this point from my

1104
00:41:25,510 --> 00:41:23,040
understanding of what that guy

1105
00:41:26,950 --> 00:41:25,520
who's running these

1106
00:41:29,589 --> 00:41:26,960
psyops

1107
00:41:31,750 --> 00:41:29,599
what he's doing and so i just want to

1108
00:41:33,829 --> 00:41:31,760
for a minute kind of remove the

1109
00:41:34,710 --> 00:41:33,839
spiritual part of that and just look at

1110
00:41:37,990 --> 00:41:34,720
the

1111
00:41:40,550 --> 00:41:38,000
if i was charged with doing that job and

1112
00:41:41,430 --> 00:41:40,560
i was like into it and wanted to do that

1113
00:41:45,990 --> 00:41:41,440
job

1114
00:41:46,790 --> 00:41:46,000
this is how i do it i mix information

1115
00:41:48,390 --> 00:41:46,800
with

1116
00:41:51,109 --> 00:41:48,400
false information

1117
00:41:52,950 --> 00:41:51,119
i'd have exaggerated information i'd

1118
00:41:55,510 --> 00:41:52,960
somehow find like

1119
00:41:57,589 --> 00:41:55,520
when i see people take off on

1120
00:42:00,870 --> 00:41:57,599
flat earth or tataria

1121
00:42:03,190 --> 00:42:00,880
i'd subtly kind of really promote that

1122
00:42:04,630 --> 00:42:03,200
because that's going to divide this

1123
00:42:06,230 --> 00:42:04,640
group in a way that they don't even

1124
00:42:08,069 --> 00:42:06,240
realize because people are going to be

1125
00:42:12,069 --> 00:42:08,079
forced to choose you know is it good

1126
00:42:14,390 --> 00:42:12,079
so there's all these techniques uh

1127
00:42:17,910 --> 00:42:14,400
plays in the playbook uh part of the

1128
00:42:20,550 --> 00:42:17,920
trade that when when we shift over and

1129
00:42:21,670 --> 00:42:20,560
we're talking about that i think we have

1130
00:42:23,190 --> 00:42:21,680
to kind of

1131
00:42:24,870 --> 00:42:23,200
say okay i'm turning my back on the

1132
00:42:26,870 --> 00:42:24,880
spiritual because i'm not assuming that

1133
00:42:29,510 --> 00:42:26,880
these guys are working on that level

1134
00:42:31,430 --> 00:42:29,520
they're just doing their freaking job

1135
00:42:33,589 --> 00:42:31,440
okay okay okay i like this i like where

1136
00:42:35,349 --> 00:42:33,599
we're going here because okay

1137
00:42:37,990 --> 00:42:35,359
so

1138
00:42:40,150 --> 00:42:38,000
maybe it's more like

1139
00:42:42,069 --> 00:42:40,160
what they're doing out there

1140
00:42:44,710 --> 00:42:42,079
is simply influencing our personal

1141
00:42:47,109 --> 00:42:44,720
consciousness to act in that way

1142
00:42:49,270 --> 00:42:47,119
sometimes you know maybe that's why i'm

1143
00:42:51,109 --> 00:42:49,280
making that connection but at the same

1144
00:42:53,030 --> 00:42:51,119
time also we kind of can go back to what

1145
00:42:54,630 --> 00:42:53,040
we were saying before about how

1146
00:42:56,230 --> 00:42:54,640
you know just because we can relate

1147
00:42:58,790 --> 00:42:56,240
everything outwards to the greater

1148
00:43:00,550 --> 00:42:58,800
fractal reality of spirituality or

1149
00:43:02,069 --> 00:43:00,560
something like that doesn't mean that we

1150
00:43:03,510 --> 00:43:02,079
don't have to go to work tomorrow

1151
00:43:05,910 --> 00:43:03,520
doesn't mean we don't have to deal with

1152
00:43:07,910 --> 00:43:05,920
this physical situation that maybe when

1153
00:43:10,150 --> 00:43:07,920
we take a big step back it's this

1154
00:43:12,150 --> 00:43:10,160
beautiful mosaic but when you get up

1155
00:43:14,150 --> 00:43:12,160
close there's individual free will

1156
00:43:17,030 --> 00:43:14,160
that's pushing and pulling and making

1157
00:43:19,990 --> 00:43:17,040
their own decisions that impact everyone

1158
00:43:21,670 --> 00:43:20,000
else and can really screw things up

1159
00:43:22,550 --> 00:43:21,680
does that sound a little bit more on

1160
00:43:25,510 --> 00:43:22,560
point

1161
00:43:27,750 --> 00:43:25,520
yeah exactly and you know it's partly

1162
00:43:30,470 --> 00:43:27,760
because i come at this from a business

1163
00:43:32,950 --> 00:43:30,480
background in that you know that was my

1164
00:43:35,190 --> 00:43:32,960
that was my focus for my life it's like

1165
00:43:37,910 --> 00:43:35,200
hey man i want to make the dough you

1166
00:43:40,470 --> 00:43:37,920
know so i was computer science guy and

1167
00:43:42,390 --> 00:43:40,480
then i got an mba and then i started a

1168
00:43:45,349 --> 00:43:42,400
tech company

1169
00:43:47,589 --> 00:43:45,359
and i was all in it because

1170
00:43:51,349 --> 00:43:47,599
i had this spiritual side of me and i

1171
00:43:52,230 --> 00:43:51,359
was doing yoga yogananda classes and all

1172
00:43:54,870 --> 00:43:52,240
that

1173
00:43:56,790 --> 00:43:54,880
but to me money was clarity i would

1174
00:43:59,750 --> 00:43:56,800
never have known

1175
00:44:02,230 --> 00:43:59,760
my own [\h__\h] unless i could

1176
00:44:03,510 --> 00:44:02,240
get to some point where like okay

1177
00:44:05,109 --> 00:44:03,520
got that

1178
00:44:06,790 --> 00:44:05,119
check now

1179
00:44:09,270 --> 00:44:06,800
explore this other stuff

1180
00:44:11,349 --> 00:44:09,280
in the realm the only way that i was

1181
00:44:13,190 --> 00:44:11,359
able to be successful in business

1182
00:44:15,829 --> 00:44:13,200
was by just doing the same thing that i

1183
00:44:18,230 --> 00:44:15,839
do now just learning [\h__\h] you know i i

1184
00:44:21,910 --> 00:44:18,240
had the educational stuff but my real

1185
00:44:22,870 --> 00:44:21,920
education came from books from seminars

1186
00:44:24,870 --> 00:44:22,880
from

1187
00:44:26,710 --> 00:44:24,880
youtube's before there were youtubes you

1188
00:44:28,710 --> 00:44:26,720
know and i was always and i had them in

1189
00:44:30,950 --> 00:44:28,720
my car's always listening 10 times over

1190
00:44:34,150 --> 00:44:30,960
and you know all the classic kind of

1191
00:44:36,470 --> 00:44:34,160
ones and i still do to this day because

1192
00:44:39,030 --> 00:44:36,480
i love learning and i love staying kind

1193
00:44:41,349 --> 00:44:39,040
of on top of my game so where i was

1194
00:44:43,030 --> 00:44:41,359
going to take that is like if you look

1195
00:44:45,670 --> 00:44:43,040
at sales

1196
00:44:47,750 --> 00:44:45,680
training for lack of a better term sales

1197
00:44:51,510 --> 00:44:47,760
self-help stuff like that

1198
00:44:55,589 --> 00:44:51,520
there is so much of that that is pure

1199
00:44:58,390 --> 00:44:55,599
black magic left hand path yep jordan

1200
00:45:00,950 --> 00:44:58,400
belfort go read jordan belfort wolf of

1201
00:45:03,430 --> 00:45:00,960
wall street go read his book on selling

1202
00:45:07,670 --> 00:45:03,440
it's one of the best books out there on

1203
00:45:10,150 --> 00:45:07,680
selling it is black magic now

1204
00:45:12,470 --> 00:45:10,160
you have to dive really deep into

1205
00:45:15,430 --> 00:45:12,480
understanding

1206
00:45:17,990 --> 00:45:15,440
what that means in terms of black magic

1207
00:45:20,550 --> 00:45:18,000
or you're going to go down and think

1208
00:45:22,390 --> 00:45:20,560
damien eccles is kind of a cool guy even

1209
00:45:25,030 --> 00:45:22,400
though he raped and killed three little

1210
00:45:27,510 --> 00:45:25,040
kids because he was following aleister

1211
00:45:29,270 --> 00:45:27,520
crowley and thought that was magic

1212
00:45:30,550 --> 00:45:29,280
and so

1213
00:45:32,230 --> 00:45:30,560
so that's another yeah i threw out a

1214
00:45:35,349 --> 00:45:32,240
little grenade there to see if anyone

1215
00:45:38,910 --> 00:45:35,359
would would i like to blow up on that

1216
00:45:42,390 --> 00:45:38,920
so but i think it's kind of interesting

1217
00:45:44,550 --> 00:45:42,400
juxtaposing damien echols and jordan

1218
00:45:46,710 --> 00:45:44,560
belfort and then oh here's the third guy

1219
00:45:48,550 --> 00:45:46,720
i'll throw in gosh i forget his name but

1220
00:45:50,390 --> 00:45:48,560
his book is uh never split the

1221
00:45:52,390 --> 00:45:50,400
difference never split the difference

1222
00:45:54,870 --> 00:45:52,400
negotiating as if your life depended on

1223
00:45:57,109 --> 00:45:54,880
it chris that's it chris voss

1224
00:45:58,790 --> 00:45:57,119
is that boss okay

1225
00:45:59,670 --> 00:45:58,800
interesting i love this guy i hate this

1226
00:46:03,270 --> 00:45:59,680
guy

1227
00:46:04,630 --> 00:46:03,280
but

1228
00:46:06,470 --> 00:46:04,640
check this out

1229
00:46:08,550 --> 00:46:06,480
this is i want you on that wall i need

1230
00:46:12,630 --> 00:46:08,560
you on that wall stuff

1231
00:46:14,470 --> 00:46:12,640
vos is an fbi negotiator he opens up

1232
00:46:17,270 --> 00:46:14,480
that book with a story

1233
00:46:19,510 --> 00:46:17,280
of being in manhattan two guys have

1234
00:46:21,589 --> 00:46:19,520
robbed a bank taken a dozen people

1235
00:46:24,550 --> 00:46:21,599
hostage are holding a gun to their head

1236
00:46:26,950 --> 00:46:24,560
and saying get us a car get us out of

1237
00:46:31,829 --> 00:46:26,960
here or we're gonna kill these people

1238
00:46:32,870 --> 00:46:31,839
right now his job is to use his black

1239
00:46:36,630 --> 00:46:32,880
magic

1240
00:46:39,510 --> 00:46:36,640
to negotiate out of this situation

1241
00:46:42,150 --> 00:46:39,520
do we want him to use his left-hand path

1242
00:46:43,829 --> 00:46:42,160
[\h__\h] we're like yeah man those innocent

1243
00:46:47,109 --> 00:46:43,839
people just showed up for work they

1244
00:46:49,829 --> 00:46:47,119
didn't deserve that so do what you have

1245
00:46:52,870 --> 00:46:49,839
to do which we've told every

1246
00:46:55,670 --> 00:46:52,880
soldier and how our country got to do

1247
00:46:57,270 --> 00:46:55,680
what you have to do

1248
00:46:59,109 --> 00:46:57,280
the point is

1249
00:47:01,349 --> 00:46:59,119
how do we understand that how do we

1250
00:47:04,230 --> 00:47:01,359
process that and then how do we process

1251
00:47:07,109 --> 00:47:04,240
damien eccles too

1252
00:47:08,390 --> 00:47:07,119
that was awesome man because you're you

1253
00:47:10,870 --> 00:47:08,400
kind of

1254
00:47:12,390 --> 00:47:10,880
paint the picture that this left-hand

1255
00:47:15,190 --> 00:47:12,400
right-hand path

1256
00:47:17,829 --> 00:47:15,200
is kind of built into a lot of the act

1257
00:47:20,069 --> 00:47:17,839
the everyday actions the the constant

1258
00:47:21,910 --> 00:47:20,079
human behavior we see everywhere i

1259
00:47:23,990 --> 00:47:21,920
wonder if it's it can be split right

1260
00:47:26,150 --> 00:47:24,000
down the middle in that case like do

1261
00:47:28,390 --> 00:47:26,160
you know how we're all doing left hand

1262
00:47:29,829 --> 00:47:28,400
or right hand path magic probably both

1263
00:47:31,349 --> 00:47:29,839
at times

1264
00:47:33,829 --> 00:47:31,359
you know without even knowing it without

1265
00:47:36,230 --> 00:47:33,839
having any background or education into

1266
00:47:39,109 --> 00:47:36,240
magic or even thinking it's all hui

1267
00:47:41,829 --> 00:47:39,119
we're still doing it you know it's crazy

1268
00:47:43,750 --> 00:47:41,839
and you know to to add a little bit of i

1269
00:47:46,710 --> 00:47:43,760
guess bones to that so it doesn't sound

1270
00:47:49,589 --> 00:47:46,720
totally abstract if you read vos's book

1271
00:47:51,270 --> 00:47:49,599
the first thing he says is that one

1272
00:47:53,750 --> 00:47:51,280
everybody talks too much in these

1273
00:47:56,150 --> 00:47:53,760
situations negotiating situations or

1274
00:47:57,990 --> 00:47:56,160
selling situations they're parallel talk

1275
00:47:59,109 --> 00:47:58,000
too much

1276
00:48:01,990 --> 00:47:59,119
silence

1277
00:48:04,309 --> 00:48:02,000
right so oh well that's not black magic

1278
00:48:07,750 --> 00:48:04,319
ah it's a technique now

1279
00:48:11,349 --> 00:48:07,760
the next exactly the the the next thing

1280
00:48:14,069 --> 00:48:11,359
is empathetic questioning right so and

1281
00:48:16,309 --> 00:48:14,079
and but then he gets much deeper so you

1282
00:48:18,870 --> 00:48:16,319
know making that person feel heard we've

1283
00:48:21,190 --> 00:48:18,880
all heard of this stuff

1284
00:48:23,829 --> 00:48:21,200
once you get into it deeper and deeper

1285
00:48:27,589 --> 00:48:23,839
you at some point have to acknowledge

1286
00:48:31,430 --> 00:48:27,599
he's trying to manipulate consciousness

1287
00:48:33,430 --> 00:48:31,440
yes in order to get to his end game in

1288
00:48:34,470 --> 00:48:33,440
the same way that

1289
00:48:36,309 --> 00:48:34,480
for those

1290
00:48:38,150 --> 00:48:36,319
out there that you know are into a lot

1291
00:48:40,309 --> 00:48:38,160
of the topics i talk about but maybe not

1292
00:48:42,549 --> 00:48:40,319
the magic side of it you know this is a

1293
00:48:45,589 --> 00:48:42,559
really important part that

1294
00:48:47,990 --> 00:48:45,599
manipulation is literally you're always

1295
00:48:49,910 --> 00:48:48,000
after some goal in the material world

1296
00:48:50,870 --> 00:48:49,920
whether it's affection from someone that

1297
00:48:52,470 --> 00:48:50,880
you don't deserve because you're

1298
00:48:55,349 --> 00:48:52,480
treating them horribly whatever the

1299
00:48:57,829 --> 00:48:55,359
situation it's a material gain in this

1300
00:48:59,910 --> 00:48:57,839
experience so you're literally

1301
00:49:01,270 --> 00:48:59,920
doing magic whether you believe in it or

1302
00:49:03,750 --> 00:49:01,280
not you're literally taking something

1303
00:49:05,750 --> 00:49:03,760
that exists in the consciousness and

1304
00:49:08,790 --> 00:49:05,760
bringing it into this world and we're

1305
00:49:09,829 --> 00:49:08,800
doing that all the time and it's so

1306
00:49:12,710 --> 00:49:09,839
subtle

1307
00:49:15,190 --> 00:49:12,720
that it's just ignored it's not believed

1308
00:49:17,109 --> 00:49:15,200
in it's laughed at and like i said to

1309
00:49:17,910 --> 00:49:17,119
you in that random little rant i sent

1310
00:49:22,790 --> 00:49:17,920
you

1311
00:49:25,430 --> 00:49:22,800
coming out of sticks and stuff like that

1312
00:49:27,030 --> 00:49:25,440
it's this parody because that's that way

1313
00:49:28,549 --> 00:49:27,040
no one really recognizes what's

1314
00:49:30,230 --> 00:49:28,559
happening all the time

1315
00:49:33,349 --> 00:49:30,240
my big thing a couple years ago i wrote

1316
00:49:37,430 --> 00:49:33,359
this book rival matters my point with

1317
00:49:39,990 --> 00:49:37,440
why evil matters was to really say okay

1318
00:49:42,230 --> 00:49:40,000
consciousness is conspiratorial that

1319
00:49:44,470 --> 00:49:42,240
scientific materialism insists that you

1320
00:49:46,230 --> 00:49:44,480
you know that's that's out the window no

1321
00:49:48,630 --> 00:49:46,240
one really believed that but this

1322
00:49:50,390 --> 00:49:48,640
extended consciousness realm

1323
00:49:52,549 --> 00:49:50,400
now brings us to

1324
00:49:54,710 --> 00:49:52,559
the real question we have in our life

1325
00:49:57,910 --> 00:49:54,720
how should i live my life what are the

1326
00:49:59,670 --> 00:49:57,920
what is right action is there such a

1327
00:50:01,750 --> 00:49:59,680
thing as right action hey is the right

1328
00:50:03,349 --> 00:50:01,760
or wrong hey maybe you know it's all

1329
00:50:05,349 --> 00:50:03,359
relative kind of thing

1330
00:50:07,910 --> 00:50:05,359
and the way that i think what brings

1331
00:50:10,390 --> 00:50:07,920
that into focus better than anything

1332
00:50:11,750 --> 00:50:10,400
else is evil

1333
00:50:14,150 --> 00:50:11,760
and that's another one it immediately

1334
00:50:17,349 --> 00:50:14,160
triggers people to go no there's no such

1335
00:50:19,750 --> 00:50:17,359
thing as evil evil is a social construct

1336
00:50:21,990 --> 00:50:19,760
and it's what you define you know

1337
00:50:23,510 --> 00:50:22,000
whatever you think it is it is and it's

1338
00:50:25,990 --> 00:50:23,520
like okay

1339
00:50:27,670 --> 00:50:26,000
let me tell you story from the book

1340
00:50:30,470 --> 00:50:27,680
another fbi guy

1341
00:50:33,349 --> 00:50:30,480
i really not an fbi guy how do you get

1342
00:50:35,190 --> 00:50:33,359
how do you do how do you do that fbi

1343
00:50:38,470 --> 00:50:35,200
thing oh my god with

1344
00:50:39,990 --> 00:50:38,480
with j edgar hoover um i mean i people i

1345
00:50:41,829 --> 00:50:40,000
i don't want to get taught but but i

1346
00:50:42,950 --> 00:50:41,839
don't anyone who says they're fbi i'm

1347
00:50:45,589 --> 00:50:42,960
like

1348
00:50:48,950 --> 00:50:45,599
j edgar hoover man what what

1349
00:50:51,030 --> 00:50:48,960
how are you processing that but

1350
00:50:54,390 --> 00:50:51,040
so i interview this guy

1351
00:50:55,990 --> 00:50:54,400
he's an undercover fbi agent

1352
00:50:58,069 --> 00:50:56,000
it is difficult to become an undercover

1353
00:50:59,430 --> 00:50:58,079
fbi agent but it also takes a certain

1354
00:51:01,349 --> 00:50:59,440
kind of person

1355
00:51:03,030 --> 00:51:01,359
back andy to what we're talking about in

1356
00:51:04,630 --> 00:51:03,040
terms of you know who is that kind of

1357
00:51:07,190 --> 00:51:04,640
person who can spin that magic because

1358
00:51:09,750 --> 00:51:07,200
that's magic too right you have to cloak

1359
00:51:12,870 --> 00:51:09,760
yourself you have to become that other

1360
00:51:14,549 --> 00:51:12,880
character and it's acting and is that

1361
00:51:16,069 --> 00:51:14,559
magic but this is even at a different

1362
00:51:18,309 --> 00:51:16,079
level because this is life or death this

1363
00:51:21,270 --> 00:51:18,319
guy's working with drug dealers arms

1364
00:51:25,270 --> 00:51:21,280
dealers gang members all this stuff

1365
00:51:27,829 --> 00:51:25,280
his last gig he's infiltrating nambla

1366
00:51:29,990 --> 00:51:27,839
you know which is south park it's funny

1367
00:51:32,390 --> 00:51:30,000
you know

1368
00:51:34,390 --> 00:51:32,400
he's in new york on one of their field

1369
00:51:36,790 --> 00:51:34,400
trips and

1370
00:51:38,630 --> 00:51:36,800
they're in the old toys r us that used

1371
00:51:41,190 --> 00:51:38,640
to be in times square and they're on the

1372
00:51:44,390 --> 00:51:41,200
railing looking down at this 20-foot

1373
00:51:45,990 --> 00:51:44,400
big carousel ferris wheel and they're

1374
00:51:48,390 --> 00:51:46,000
these men

1375
00:51:50,150 --> 00:51:48,400
are looking at these little kids

1376
00:51:52,150 --> 00:51:50,160
and they're talking about what they want

1377
00:51:54,950 --> 00:51:52,160
to do to these kids and it's not just

1378
00:51:57,829 --> 00:51:54,960
sexual they want to inflict pain because

1379
00:52:01,349 --> 00:51:57,839
it's a power and it's a control thing

1380
00:52:03,750 --> 00:52:01,359
and he said man alex if i wasn't

1381
00:52:05,750 --> 00:52:03,760
undercover i would have picked them

1382
00:52:09,270 --> 00:52:05,760
[\h__\h] up and thrown them over that

1383
00:52:11,030 --> 00:52:09,280
rail and watched their head splatter

1384
00:52:13,430 --> 00:52:11,040
yeah as a father of a restraint you'd

1385
00:52:16,390 --> 00:52:13,440
have to have oh my god

1386
00:52:19,430 --> 00:52:16,400
as a father so maybe not even

1387
00:52:21,670 --> 00:52:19,440
no i get it i get it as a father of four

1388
00:52:25,750 --> 00:52:21,680
and and so but here's the point

1389
00:52:27,589 --> 00:52:25,760
is is is that evil yeah allowing that

1390
00:52:29,510 --> 00:52:27,599
for some greater good some abstract

1391
00:52:31,190 --> 00:52:29,520
greater good well i wasn't even going

1392
00:52:33,109 --> 00:52:31,200
there andy i was okay the first part

1393
00:52:34,470 --> 00:52:33,119
because the people who are on the fence

1394
00:52:36,069 --> 00:52:34,480
about evil

1395
00:52:37,589 --> 00:52:36,079
everyone i've talked to they come right

1396
00:52:39,910 --> 00:52:37,599
off the fence they go no that's [\h__\h]

1397
00:52:43,270 --> 00:52:39,920
evil that's [\h__\h] evil somebody wants

1398
00:52:45,190 --> 00:52:43,280
to do that to somebody

1399
00:52:47,349 --> 00:52:45,200
no i totally i know stealing of

1400
00:52:49,750 --> 00:52:47,359
innocence yes the removal of innocence

1401
00:52:51,750 --> 00:52:49,760
is the uh i think for some reason we

1402
00:52:53,190 --> 00:52:51,760
could explore that for hours and hours

1403
00:52:55,430 --> 00:52:53,200
as a root

1404
00:52:57,829 --> 00:52:55,440
problem in society and civilization and

1405
00:52:58,950 --> 00:52:57,839
history in a way it it kind of rolls us

1406
00:53:01,750 --> 00:52:58,960
back to the very beginning of this

1407
00:53:04,470 --> 00:53:01,760
conversation it's like everyone has an

1408
00:53:07,750 --> 00:53:04,480
opinion everyone's voice matters it's

1409
00:53:10,390 --> 00:53:07,760
like let me anchor you now because i

1410
00:53:12,470 --> 00:53:10,400
said evil and you said evil is a social

1411
00:53:14,309 --> 00:53:12,480
construct there's really no such thing

1412
00:53:17,349 --> 00:53:14,319
as good and bad now i'm going to anchor

1413
00:53:19,750 --> 00:53:17,359
you with that experience and you're

1414
00:53:21,589 --> 00:53:19,760
going to come off of that [\h__\h]

1415
00:53:23,430 --> 00:53:21,599
agnostic

1416
00:53:24,390 --> 00:53:23,440
middle never hold stuff and you're going

1417
00:53:28,390 --> 00:53:24,400
to go

1418
00:53:30,549 --> 00:53:28,400
okay i get it yes yes that is evil

1419
00:53:32,710 --> 00:53:30,559
everyone says that and what they don't

1420
00:53:35,190 --> 00:53:32,720
realize as soon as you have anchored

1421
00:53:36,309 --> 00:53:35,200
that and driven that stake in the ground

1422
00:53:38,710 --> 00:53:36,319
now

1423
00:53:40,390 --> 00:53:38,720
you're playing in a different

1424
00:53:42,470 --> 00:53:40,400
field and it's the one that we've been

1425
00:53:45,030 --> 00:53:42,480
talking about here like so

1426
00:53:47,030 --> 00:53:45,040
so what does that really mean now that

1427
00:53:48,390 --> 00:53:47,040
there is evil and what if we atta what

1428
00:53:50,950 --> 00:53:48,400
if we connect that with what we said

1429
00:53:54,150 --> 00:53:50,960
that hey this extended consciousness

1430
00:53:56,390 --> 00:53:54,160
realm that seems real too

1431
00:53:58,150 --> 00:53:56,400
so is there evil there

1432
00:54:00,390 --> 00:53:58,160
and there's evil here

1433
00:54:02,790 --> 00:54:00,400
and there's good and now

1434
00:54:04,230 --> 00:54:02,800
now i'm ready to talk you know now i'm

1435
00:54:06,309 --> 00:54:04,240
ready to talk

1436
00:54:08,230 --> 00:54:06,319
hell yeah man yeah this is a lot this is

1437
00:54:10,309 --> 00:54:08,240
a lot to unpack um

1438
00:54:12,549 --> 00:54:10,319
but so i would like to clarify because i

1439
00:54:14,870 --> 00:54:12,559
tend to generalize too much sometimes i

1440
00:54:16,630 --> 00:54:14,880
would like to rewrite what i said about

1441
00:54:18,549 --> 00:54:16,640
everybody has their their puzzle piece

1442
00:54:20,069 --> 00:54:18,559
that matters i would like to say

1443
00:54:22,230 --> 00:54:20,079
that everyone that's

1444
00:54:26,309 --> 00:54:22,240
in this line of questioning and everyone

1445
00:54:27,670 --> 00:54:26,319
that's pursuing wisdom and we we may be

1446
00:54:29,829 --> 00:54:27,680
off here and there maybe i'm talking

1447
00:54:31,829 --> 00:54:29,839
about our community perhaps or even the

1448
00:54:33,910 --> 00:54:31,839
listeners people that are asking these

1449
00:54:35,910 --> 00:54:33,920
questions and going against what society

1450
00:54:38,390 --> 00:54:35,920
would like them to do and they're taking

1451
00:54:40,309 --> 00:54:38,400
that route of asking weird questions and

1452
00:54:41,990 --> 00:54:40,319
finding you know seeking i would say

1453
00:54:43,589 --> 00:54:42,000
that each one of us is doing that

1454
00:54:45,910 --> 00:54:43,599
because of something inside that tells

1455
00:54:47,349 --> 00:54:45,920
us we have to go against this grain and

1456
00:54:49,430 --> 00:54:47,359
i think that's the puzzle piece i'm

1457
00:54:51,829 --> 00:54:49,440
talking about so no you know someone in

1458
00:54:53,270 --> 00:54:51,839
my life that i you know won't name that

1459
00:54:54,870 --> 00:54:53,280
doesn't like any of this stuff yeah

1460
00:54:56,069 --> 00:54:54,880
their puzzle piece if they they probably

1461
00:54:58,150 --> 00:54:56,079
don't have one or it's been

1462
00:55:00,470 --> 00:54:58,160
disintegrated or maybe they traded it

1463
00:55:02,470 --> 00:55:00,480
for something you know but yeah i would

1464
00:55:04,470 --> 00:55:02,480
like to clarify that and maybe scale it

1465
00:55:05,670 --> 00:55:04,480
down a bit that there's those among us

1466
00:55:10,150 --> 00:55:05,680
that

1467
00:55:12,470 --> 00:55:10,160
search for something i guess and others

1468
00:55:13,750 --> 00:55:12,480
that don't you know i know that that

1469
00:55:15,670 --> 00:55:13,760
doesn't really

1470
00:55:17,670 --> 00:55:15,680
necessarily respond to everything you

1471
00:55:19,190 --> 00:55:17,680
said but you said a lot there um but

1472
00:55:21,670 --> 00:55:19,200
that's just to kick it off a little bit

1473
00:55:24,150 --> 00:55:21,680
you know well i'd also

1474
00:55:25,510 --> 00:55:24,160
tie it back to and we said this before

1475
00:55:27,349 --> 00:55:25,520
i'm not against

1476
00:55:29,829 --> 00:55:27,359
everyone has a puzzle piece because on

1477
00:55:31,589 --> 00:55:29,839
some level from a spiritual perspective

1478
00:55:33,990 --> 00:55:31,599
like we were talking about

1479
00:55:35,829 --> 00:55:34,000
that's undeniable i mean everyone has a

1480
00:55:37,349 --> 00:55:35,839
puzzle piece for their puzzle you know

1481
00:55:38,309 --> 00:55:37,359
sometimes it gets destroyed when they're

1482
00:55:40,309 --> 00:55:38,319
children

1483
00:55:41,190 --> 00:55:40,319
or well you know with trauma and all

1484
00:55:43,270 --> 00:55:41,200
that

1485
00:55:44,870 --> 00:55:43,280
or you know it

1486
00:55:47,190 --> 00:55:44,880
you know as all these

1487
00:55:49,430 --> 00:55:47,200
analogies we could do or it gets hidden

1488
00:55:51,190 --> 00:55:49,440
and then the their job is to rediscover

1489
00:55:52,950 --> 00:55:51,200
it you know and you can say all this but

1490
00:55:54,710 --> 00:55:52,960
and i don't want to demean that or sound

1491
00:55:55,430 --> 00:55:54,720
like i'm being you know demeaning

1492
00:55:57,589 --> 00:55:55,440
because

1493
00:55:59,349 --> 00:55:57,599
like the the part that we connected with

1494
00:56:01,270 --> 00:55:59,359
at the beginning is that

1495
00:56:03,109 --> 00:56:01,280
the spiritual journey sounds trite but

1496
00:56:05,270 --> 00:56:03,119
it's ultimately

1497
00:56:06,710 --> 00:56:05,280
it's true everything we run across it so

1498
00:56:08,390 --> 00:56:06,720
right i'm on this spiritual journey

1499
00:56:10,470 --> 00:56:08,400
you're on the spiritual journey and the

1500
00:56:12,470 --> 00:56:10,480
person who's clueless you know neil

1501
00:56:13,510 --> 00:56:12,480
degrasse tyson is on a spiritual journey

1502
00:56:16,069 --> 00:56:13,520
and you know that's one of the things

1503
00:56:18,069 --> 00:56:16,079
that that's one of my other kind of pet

1504
00:56:20,789 --> 00:56:18,079
peeve little pet projects right now is

1505
00:56:23,589 --> 00:56:20,799
rich spiritual lives how does this world

1506
00:56:26,950 --> 00:56:23,599
look like if we accept this

1507
00:56:29,670 --> 00:56:26,960
kind of obvious fact once you process it

1508
00:56:30,390 --> 00:56:29,680
is we're all living rich spiritual lives

1509
00:56:32,069 --> 00:56:30,400
right

1510
00:56:35,109 --> 00:56:32,079
so that guy

1511
00:56:37,670 --> 00:56:35,119
who was looking at that kid

1512
00:56:40,710 --> 00:56:37,680
he's living a rich spiritual life that's

1513
00:56:43,990 --> 00:56:40,720
his voice the voice inside he's got the

1514
00:56:46,630 --> 00:56:44,000
same voices not the same but he has the

1515
00:56:48,870 --> 00:56:46,640
voices and he's wrestling with them and

1516
00:56:52,150 --> 00:56:48,880
human musk is wrestling with them and

1517
00:56:54,789 --> 00:56:52,160
bill gates and they're not just and yeah

1518
00:56:56,950 --> 00:56:54,799
they're human totally but where i think

1519
00:57:00,150 --> 00:56:56,960
we need to go with that is

1520
00:57:02,870 --> 00:57:00,160
they're leading rich spiritual lives

1521
00:57:05,349 --> 00:57:02,880
this that implies this extended

1522
00:57:08,870 --> 00:57:05,359
consciousness realm that like you tapped

1523
00:57:10,390 --> 00:57:08,880
into with your experience like

1524
00:57:11,910 --> 00:57:10,400
you you already said this so i'm just

1525
00:57:13,589 --> 00:57:11,920
going to kind of bring it back to the

1526
00:57:17,030 --> 00:57:13,599
surface

1527
00:57:19,910 --> 00:57:17,040
is your understanding that that extended

1528
00:57:20,870 --> 00:57:19,920
realm that you were in is somehow

1529
00:57:23,270 --> 00:57:20,880
gone

1530
00:57:25,270 --> 00:57:23,280
shut off from you now that you're back

1531
00:57:28,549 --> 00:57:25,280
or is it still connected to you in some

1532
00:57:30,870 --> 00:57:28,559
way oh yeah i guess well the way it felt

1533
00:57:32,390 --> 00:57:30,880
to me was that it faded like it was like

1534
00:57:35,109 --> 00:57:32,400
okay we're gonna we're gonna go back

1535
00:57:37,829 --> 00:57:35,119
into the shadows now but it's always

1536
00:57:39,510 --> 00:57:37,839
here it's always around you it's

1537
00:57:41,109 --> 00:57:39,520
constant it's like terence i'll bring

1538
00:57:42,470 --> 00:57:41,119
them up again because you know how you

1539
00:57:45,430 --> 00:57:42,480
said you were always listening in the

1540
00:57:47,670 --> 00:57:45,440
car man i spent my entire 20s

1541
00:57:50,150 --> 00:57:47,680
just doing my job and listening to

1542
00:57:51,670 --> 00:57:50,160
endless lectures from people i wanted to

1543
00:57:53,670 --> 00:57:51,680
hear about and terrence was one of them

1544
00:57:55,990 --> 00:57:53,680
that i just happened to have like 15

1545
00:57:58,789 --> 00:57:56,000
hours of lectures and he once said about

1546
00:58:01,510 --> 00:57:58,799
how someone came in the room during the

1547
00:58:04,390 --> 00:58:01,520
middle of a dmt trip and it kind of sent

1548
00:58:06,069 --> 00:58:04,400
his consciousness right back to normal

1549
00:58:08,789 --> 00:58:06,079
everyday reality kind of trying to

1550
00:58:10,549 --> 00:58:08,799
address this friend that walked in but

1551
00:58:13,829 --> 00:58:10,559
the elves were still hanging from the

1552
00:58:15,349 --> 00:58:13,839
curtains and they were going oh shh

1553
00:58:17,589 --> 00:58:15,359
you know it's like it and of course it's

1554
00:58:19,270 --> 00:58:17,599
a reflection of how he felt was on their

1555
00:58:21,510 --> 00:58:19,280
faces and everything

1556
00:58:23,349 --> 00:58:21,520
it's always there it's always a part of

1557
00:58:26,069 --> 00:58:23,359
us and uh yeah that's where my

1558
00:58:27,750 --> 00:58:26,079
questioning has been a lot lately in

1559
00:58:29,670 --> 00:58:27,760
regards to near-death experience and

1560
00:58:31,670 --> 00:58:29,680
stuff like that because again for some

1561
00:58:33,270 --> 00:58:31,680
reason unlike some of my friends that

1562
00:58:36,630 --> 00:58:33,280
would take the same damn bag of

1563
00:58:39,349 --> 00:58:36,640
mushrooms with me i had this

1564
00:58:41,109 --> 00:58:39,359
profound perspective given to me that

1565
00:58:41,910 --> 00:58:41,119
directly relates to a lot of what i hear

1566
00:58:45,270 --> 00:58:41,920
from

1567
00:58:48,230 --> 00:58:45,280
written about near-death experience and

1568
00:58:50,069 --> 00:58:48,240
stuff um so maybe i just need to go back

1569
00:58:52,390 --> 00:58:50,079
into those realms again and refresh

1570
00:58:54,230 --> 00:58:52,400
myself maybe my ego will get slapped

1571
00:58:56,549 --> 00:58:54,240
around like you thought this was just

1572
00:58:59,190 --> 00:58:56,559
inside your head again how long have you

1573
00:59:00,950 --> 00:58:59,200
been away from this place come on

1574
00:59:03,510 --> 00:59:00,960
you know maybe a refresher this is why

1575
00:59:05,589 --> 00:59:03,520
people meditate right keep that state of

1576
00:59:07,990 --> 00:59:05,599
mind more and more present in their

1577
00:59:09,349 --> 00:59:08,000
lives i've heard that before maybe it

1578
00:59:10,950 --> 00:59:09,359
works

1579
00:59:12,390 --> 00:59:10,960
well it's interesting what you're saying

1580
00:59:14,069 --> 00:59:12,400
because you're talking about the

1581
00:59:16,789 --> 00:59:14,079
integration process

1582
00:59:18,150 --> 00:59:16,799
and then you're also talking about

1583
00:59:19,589 --> 00:59:18,160
the fact that whether you integrate or

1584
00:59:21,910 --> 00:59:19,599
not you're integrated you know what i

1585
00:59:23,589 --> 00:59:21,920
mean so i was like yes isn't that such a

1586
00:59:26,150 --> 00:59:23,599
common theme in near-death experience

1587
00:59:27,910 --> 00:59:26,160
where they say all these rules all these

1588
00:59:30,230 --> 00:59:27,920
spiritual oh you have to do this or

1589
00:59:32,390 --> 00:59:30,240
you'll never escape the the

1590
00:59:34,150 --> 00:59:32,400
you just wake up like i've heard that so

1591
00:59:35,270 --> 00:59:34,160
many times from people on my show on

1592
00:59:37,750 --> 00:59:35,280
your show

1593
00:59:40,309 --> 00:59:37,760
it's like man that throws a wrench in

1594
00:59:41,990 --> 00:59:40,319
and it really does uh you know it speaks

1595
00:59:44,390 --> 00:59:42,000
to the question you had before like is

1596
00:59:45,750 --> 00:59:44,400
there a right way to live or not because

1597
00:59:47,990 --> 00:59:45,760
a lot of near-death experience would

1598
00:59:50,549 --> 00:59:48,000
come back and say relax

1599
00:59:52,870 --> 00:59:50,559
uh you know it's okay just

1600
00:59:55,349 --> 00:59:52,880
just experience this which that has

1601
00:59:57,510 --> 00:59:55,359
implications into good or evil i would

1602
01:00:00,150 --> 00:59:57,520
say um and on the other end it's like no

1603
01:00:02,549 --> 01:00:00,160
no no you have to you know ascend to

1604
01:00:05,430 --> 01:00:02,559
this level of consciousness before you

1605
01:00:08,309 --> 01:00:05,440
die or else you're screwed or it's a

1606
01:00:11,750 --> 01:00:08,319
very dualistic again very divided

1607
01:00:14,470 --> 01:00:11,760
conquer kind of set up in it i'm in it

1608
01:00:16,710 --> 01:00:14,480
you're it we're all kind of in this like

1609
01:00:18,630 --> 01:00:16,720
where is our invincible balancing beam

1610
01:00:20,710 --> 01:00:18,640
on that issue you know

1611
01:00:22,069 --> 01:00:20,720
and oh my god

1612
01:00:24,710 --> 01:00:22,079
it's difficult it's difficult to

1613
01:00:26,549 --> 01:00:24,720
navigate and you know i to bridge into

1614
01:00:28,390 --> 01:00:26,559
something new that you and i kind of

1615
01:00:30,390 --> 01:00:28,400
wanted to talk about tactaria and flat

1616
01:00:33,109 --> 01:00:30,400
earth a little bit and again it's always

1617
01:00:33,990 --> 01:00:33,119
the same conversational in in some way

1618
01:00:36,470 --> 01:00:34,000
uh

1619
01:00:39,030 --> 01:00:36,480
that cognitive dissonance you know that

1620
01:00:41,109 --> 01:00:39,040
divide and conquer line of

1621
01:00:43,510 --> 01:00:41,119
let's get them to you know question one

1622
01:00:45,270 --> 01:00:43,520
or the other you know or you know round

1623
01:00:47,670 --> 01:00:45,280
or flat you know there's a good reason

1624
01:00:48,950 --> 01:00:47,680
to question nasa the funding behind it

1625
01:00:51,190 --> 01:00:48,960
there's good reason to question the

1626
01:00:53,430 --> 01:00:51,200
people that started it and all the

1627
01:00:55,829 --> 01:00:53,440
establishment that surrounds it and

1628
01:00:58,150 --> 01:00:55,839
there's so much good reason to question

1629
01:01:00,230 --> 01:00:58,160
nasa directly uh

1630
01:01:01,030 --> 01:01:00,240
but there's a lot of reason to hold on

1631
01:01:07,510 --> 01:01:01,040
to

1632
01:01:09,670 --> 01:01:07,520
and every religion has written that

1633
01:01:11,349 --> 01:01:09,680
about the pieces of [\h__\h] in society they

1634
01:01:12,630 --> 01:01:11,359
don't like to create they lob on to

1635
01:01:15,109 --> 01:01:12,640
what's already

1636
01:01:18,069 --> 01:01:15,119
created by the creative uh they wouldn't

1637
01:01:20,150 --> 01:01:18,079
be able to come up with some fake

1638
01:01:22,150 --> 01:01:20,160
universe i don't think i don't think

1639
01:01:24,950 --> 01:01:22,160
they would be able to come up with some

1640
01:01:27,030 --> 01:01:24,960
amazing mathematical alignment with

1641
01:01:28,950 --> 01:01:27,040
earth and the planets and the this and

1642
01:01:31,829 --> 01:01:28,960
that they're not creative enough to come

1643
01:01:33,910 --> 01:01:31,839
up with that i don't think i think if

1644
01:01:36,950 --> 01:01:33,920
anything they have to

1645
01:01:39,510 --> 01:01:36,960
skew or whatever as much as they can

1646
01:01:41,430 --> 01:01:39,520
that already exists and that's kind of

1647
01:01:43,990 --> 01:01:41,440
an extreme opinion but i don't think

1648
01:01:45,510 --> 01:01:44,000
it's extreme it's almost like so in this

1649
01:01:47,990 --> 01:01:45,520
other discussion that we're going to

1650
01:01:49,349 --> 01:01:48,000
kind of switch to

1651
01:01:51,510 --> 01:01:49,359
what i'm

1652
01:01:52,390 --> 01:01:51,520
kind of advocating for

1653
01:01:53,510 --> 01:01:52,400
is

1654
01:01:54,789 --> 01:01:53,520
science

1655
01:01:56,470 --> 01:01:54,799
okay so

1656
01:01:57,750 --> 01:01:56,480
how dare you

1657
01:02:00,870 --> 01:01:57,760
well

1658
01:02:02,549 --> 01:02:00,880
as you again as you answered you know

1659
01:02:04,630 --> 01:02:02,559
with my favorite it was my answer but

1660
01:02:06,470 --> 01:02:04,640
you picked my favorite answer is you

1661
01:02:07,510 --> 01:02:06,480
know what is science and you said it's a

1662
01:02:09,670 --> 01:02:07,520
method

1663
01:02:12,390 --> 01:02:09,680
it's not a position statement it's a

1664
01:02:14,150 --> 01:02:12,400
stepping stone that's a tool yes so

1665
01:02:18,069 --> 01:02:14,160
we've been kind of conditioned

1666
01:02:20,549 --> 01:02:18,079
especially lately i mean the most kind

1667
01:02:23,349 --> 01:02:20,559
of in your face kind of grotesque

1668
01:02:25,750 --> 01:02:23,359
example of it was with the pandemic

1669
01:02:26,789 --> 01:02:25,760
where they said you know this is science

1670
01:02:29,510 --> 01:02:26,799
this is

1671
01:02:32,470 --> 01:02:29,520
overwhelming this should end any

1672
01:02:35,910 --> 01:02:32,480
scientific debate i actually did a

1673
01:02:38,630 --> 01:02:35,920
a show on the phony mask science and a

1674
01:02:41,670 --> 01:02:38,640
guy from yale university

1675
01:02:43,829 --> 01:02:41,680
who was part of the study actually

1676
01:02:46,069 --> 01:02:43,839
was quoted as saying that

1677
01:02:49,589 --> 01:02:46,079
in the washington post

1678
01:02:52,789 --> 01:02:49,599
this should end any scientific debate

1679
01:02:55,750 --> 01:02:52,799
this is nail in the coffin research

1680
01:02:58,390 --> 01:02:55,760
this is the antithesis of the scientific

1681
01:03:01,190 --> 01:02:58,400
method yes who says this should end

1682
01:03:02,549 --> 01:03:01,200
scientific debate your spider sensei

1683
01:03:03,910 --> 01:03:02,559
should immediately be going off but i

1684
01:03:07,349 --> 01:03:03,920
digress

1685
01:03:08,870 --> 01:03:07,359
so when i kind of started skeptical eons

1686
01:03:10,630 --> 01:03:08,880
ago

1687
01:03:12,309 --> 01:03:10,640
my first

1688
01:03:13,950 --> 01:03:12,319
i was drawn to the the guys who were

1689
01:03:15,589 --> 01:03:13,960
doing science you know like the

1690
01:03:17,190 --> 01:03:15,599
parapsychology people because i was

1691
01:03:18,710 --> 01:03:17,200
interested in this question of

1692
01:03:20,950 --> 01:03:18,720
consciousness

1693
01:03:22,309 --> 01:03:20,960
and the parapsychology people are the

1694
01:03:23,910 --> 01:03:22,319
people are doing like the esp

1695
01:03:25,750 --> 01:03:23,920
experiments you know

1696
01:03:28,870 --> 01:03:25,760
i'm like okay is there anything to that

1697
01:03:32,230 --> 01:03:28,880
you know that would really kind of

1698
01:03:33,190 --> 01:03:32,240
kind of answer this question in a way

1699
01:03:35,029 --> 01:03:33,200
so

1700
01:03:37,670 --> 01:03:35,039
i got into that and

1701
01:03:39,510 --> 01:03:37,680
i had i knew science kind of but i

1702
01:03:42,230 --> 01:03:39,520
didn't you know i had to really sharpen

1703
01:03:44,230 --> 01:03:42,240
my skills i had to understand how you

1704
01:03:46,150 --> 01:03:44,240
put together a good experiment what good

1705
01:03:48,230 --> 01:03:46,160
controls will look like what fake

1706
01:03:51,349 --> 01:03:48,240
science looks like even the stuff that

1707
01:03:54,230 --> 01:03:51,359
we're inundated with all the time

1708
01:03:57,270 --> 01:03:54,240
it's an approach it's a discipline that

1709
01:03:59,750 --> 01:03:57,280
gives us a different perspective the

1710
01:04:01,029 --> 01:03:59,760
pers and it's much more of a also what

1711
01:04:02,870 --> 01:04:01,039
i'm kind of comfortable with from a

1712
01:04:04,549 --> 01:04:02,880
business standpoint from a business

1713
01:04:07,349 --> 01:04:04,559
standpoint you know what

1714
01:04:09,430 --> 01:04:07,359
you make the sale and you cash the check

1715
01:04:12,870 --> 01:04:09,440
or you do not

1716
01:04:17,829 --> 01:04:12,880
there is no in between it's did you

1717
01:04:20,630 --> 01:04:17,839
[\h__\h] get paid that is the answer so

1718
01:04:23,829 --> 01:04:20,640
science in some ways is the same

1719
01:04:24,950 --> 01:04:23,839
you know if you got a no result like i

1720
01:04:26,150 --> 01:04:24,960
don't know

1721
01:04:27,910 --> 01:04:26,160
i thought i was just in for that it

1722
01:04:30,230 --> 01:04:27,920
didn't come out like okay great you

1723
01:04:32,710 --> 01:04:30,240
gotta throw that in the scrap heap it's

1724
01:04:35,190 --> 01:04:32,720
try again you know you can try again but

1725
01:04:37,589 --> 01:04:35,200
no that's you know so

1726
01:04:39,589 --> 01:04:37,599
did you control all the variables did

1727
01:04:40,390 --> 01:04:39,599
you get a statistically significant

1728
01:04:42,309 --> 01:04:40,400
result

1729
01:04:43,990 --> 01:04:42,319
so and i'm not saying that always

1730
01:04:47,349 --> 01:04:44,000
directly applies to the stuff we're

1731
01:04:49,029 --> 01:04:47,359
talking about but i think that method

1732
01:04:52,710 --> 01:04:49,039
that we're talking about the scientific

1733
01:04:54,710 --> 01:04:52,720
method has to be applied here so

1734
01:04:57,270 --> 01:04:54,720
nasa all that stuff

1735
01:04:59,670 --> 01:04:57,280
got it understand agree you know why

1736
01:05:02,069 --> 01:04:59,680
haven't we gone back

1737
01:05:04,870 --> 01:05:02,079
you know all that yeah yeah yeah that as

1738
01:05:08,230 --> 01:05:04,880
a scientist that is noise

1739
01:05:10,390 --> 01:05:08,240
that i want to get out of the signal the

1740
01:05:14,470 --> 01:05:10,400
signal is

1741
01:05:17,029 --> 01:05:14,480
sputnik

1742
01:05:19,829 --> 01:05:17,039
1955.

1743
01:05:22,230 --> 01:05:19,839
go listen to eddie bravo

1744
01:05:25,589 --> 01:05:22,240
and his other guys i love eddie bravo's

1745
01:05:27,829 --> 01:05:25,599
fantastic jujitsu genius in so many ways

1746
01:05:29,750 --> 01:05:27,839
right but he's i don't know if he really

1747
01:05:31,990 --> 01:05:29,760
believes this [\h__\h] or or what but it's

1748
01:05:33,589 --> 01:05:32,000
like satellites are are held up by

1749
01:05:36,710 --> 01:05:33,599
helium

1750
01:05:38,789 --> 01:05:36,720
it's like this is this is like or elon

1751
01:05:39,589 --> 01:05:38,799
musk again i'm not a big elon musketeer

1752
01:05:40,950 --> 01:05:39,599
hey

1753
01:05:42,710 --> 01:05:40,960
how come

1754
01:05:44,789 --> 01:05:42,720
you know what he said flat earth he goes

1755
01:05:46,950 --> 01:05:44,799
how come there isn't any uh flat mars

1756
01:05:48,710 --> 01:05:46,960
society you know

1757
01:05:50,710 --> 01:05:48,720
because we look out we see mars we see

1758
01:05:54,710 --> 01:05:50,720
us around oh well yeah it's a

1759
01:05:57,910 --> 01:05:54,720
it it doesn't it doesn't pass

1760
01:06:00,069 --> 01:05:57,920
any kind of scientific reasonable i

1761
01:06:03,270 --> 01:06:00,079
should look at it for more than 30

1762
01:06:05,910 --> 01:06:03,280
seconds and what our community has done

1763
01:06:07,789 --> 01:06:05,920
is kind of elevated this

1764
01:06:10,470 --> 01:06:07,799
openness to

1765
01:06:13,430 --> 01:06:10,480
non-conforming ideas we've opened that

1766
01:06:16,150 --> 01:06:13,440
lens so far that we've lost the ability

1767
01:06:18,390 --> 01:06:16,160
to discern and i think the the way to

1768
01:06:21,109 --> 01:06:18,400
return to that discernment

1769
01:06:23,990 --> 01:06:21,119
is through the scientific method and

1770
01:06:26,150 --> 01:06:24,000
it's brutal but it's the way to to

1771
01:06:28,150 --> 01:06:26,160
really kind of discern and cut through

1772
01:06:29,829 --> 01:06:28,160
[\h__\h] and you've touched on a really good

1773
01:06:31,029 --> 01:06:29,839
point that in recent years we've been

1774
01:06:33,589 --> 01:06:31,039
made to

1775
01:06:36,549 --> 01:06:33,599
or or just or just willingly have

1776
01:06:38,710 --> 01:06:36,559
learned to distrust science and

1777
01:06:40,549 --> 01:06:38,720
i always use throwing the baby out with

1778
01:06:42,950 --> 01:06:40,559
the bathwater i sound like a broken

1779
01:06:45,829 --> 01:06:42,960
record but that's what a lot of people

1780
01:06:47,430 --> 01:06:45,839
do a lot of times with science is like

1781
01:06:48,870 --> 01:06:47,440
it's all failing what else are they

1782
01:06:52,390 --> 01:06:48,880
lying about

1783
01:06:53,990 --> 01:06:52,400
and i do that too i often i get that and

1784
01:06:56,470 --> 01:06:54,000
i do it with history and i do it with

1785
01:06:58,230 --> 01:06:56,480
technology a lot of different subjects

1786
01:07:00,950 --> 01:06:58,240
but again i go back to that thing where

1787
01:07:01,990 --> 01:07:00,960
i don't think they're that creative

1788
01:07:04,390 --> 01:07:02,000
one

1789
01:07:06,710 --> 01:07:04,400
um but also

1790
01:07:09,670 --> 01:07:06,720
for me with the flat earth particularly

1791
01:07:11,670 --> 01:07:09,680
it's like i really hold hold dear to

1792
01:07:13,190 --> 01:07:11,680
that as above so below principle and i

1793
01:07:15,270 --> 01:07:13,200
know that part of my community even

1794
01:07:17,670 --> 01:07:15,280
thinks that sentence is some satanic

1795
01:07:20,150 --> 01:07:17,680
thing and that's a problem too

1796
01:07:21,270 --> 01:07:20,160
but um sticking with this the as above

1797
01:07:22,950 --> 01:07:21,280
so below

1798
01:07:25,510 --> 01:07:22,960
you look at the subconscious realm you

1799
01:07:27,670 --> 01:07:25,520
look at brains compared to galaxies and

1800
01:07:28,549 --> 01:07:27,680
and you look at all that self-similar

1801
01:07:30,789 --> 01:07:28,559
behavior

1802
01:07:32,470 --> 01:07:30,799
throughout everything and it's beautiful

1803
01:07:35,029 --> 01:07:32,480
it makes up this beautiful existence

1804
01:07:37,109 --> 01:07:35,039
that we're a part of but

1805
01:07:38,950 --> 01:07:37,119
flat earth will throw out not only space

1806
01:07:40,470 --> 01:07:38,960
but also the subatomic world oh electron

1807
01:07:42,390 --> 01:07:40,480
microscopes that's all fake that's all

1808
01:07:43,589 --> 01:07:42,400
just silly stuff that they're throwing

1809
01:07:45,510 --> 01:07:43,599
in our faces

1810
01:07:48,309 --> 01:07:45,520
and i'm like come on

1811
01:07:50,950 --> 01:07:48,319
these these levels of reality that

1812
01:07:52,309 --> 01:07:50,960
exists within us as fractal as just

1813
01:07:54,150 --> 01:07:52,319
i mean that's kind of a weird way to say

1814
01:07:56,789 --> 01:07:54,160
it but

1815
01:07:59,109 --> 01:07:56,799
you can see this self-similar pattern at

1816
01:08:01,670 --> 01:07:59,119
least i did even inside myself with

1817
01:08:03,910 --> 01:08:01,680
behaviors and situations in my life from

1818
01:08:06,309 --> 01:08:03,920
the past repeating themselves in bigger

1819
01:08:08,230 --> 01:08:06,319
and better ways or worse ways depending

1820
01:08:09,750 --> 01:08:08,240
on what i was in control of negative or

1821
01:08:11,910 --> 01:08:09,760
positive doesn't matter with things that

1822
01:08:14,549 --> 01:08:11,920
go outwards through our lives on every

1823
01:08:16,470 --> 01:08:14,559
level this as above so below is such an

1824
01:08:18,309 --> 01:08:16,480
important thing to me at least

1825
01:08:20,070 --> 01:08:18,319
and to others that

1826
01:08:22,070 --> 01:08:20,080
that's where i fall with the flat earth

1827
01:08:23,749 --> 01:08:22,080
because i can get behind stuff that i

1828
01:08:24,950 --> 01:08:23,759
don't understand scientifically and go

1829
01:08:26,470 --> 01:08:24,960
home maybe

1830
01:08:28,390 --> 01:08:26,480
i don't know what a scientist would say

1831
01:08:30,630 --> 01:08:28,400
to that you know i don't know if the

1832
01:08:33,110 --> 01:08:30,640
pilot's just lying because you have a

1833
01:08:34,870 --> 01:08:33,120
camera in his face oh yeah flat totally

1834
01:08:37,110 --> 01:08:34,880
yeah we all know it up here maybe he's

1835
01:08:39,189 --> 01:08:37,120
trolling you i don't i don't know i'm

1836
01:08:41,910 --> 01:08:39,199
not going there but i can go with what i

1837
01:08:44,309 --> 01:08:41,920
feel inside and it's that

1838
01:08:46,070 --> 01:08:44,319
that flowing self-similarity that

1839
01:08:48,229 --> 01:08:46,080
happens in reality

1840
01:08:49,110 --> 01:08:48,239
but i don't know i what would you say to

1841
01:08:51,110 --> 01:08:49,120
that

1842
01:08:53,110 --> 01:08:51,120
i'd say a bunch of different

1843
01:08:54,950 --> 01:08:53,120
units no

1844
01:08:57,510 --> 01:08:54,960
i'm all over the place alex

1845
01:08:59,510 --> 01:08:57,520
no no no because no it's good stuff so

1846
01:09:01,430 --> 01:08:59,520
i'm making notes here because i want to

1847
01:09:03,510 --> 01:09:01,440
kind of respond i think

1848
01:09:04,950 --> 01:09:03,520
like one of the things that's kind of

1849
01:09:07,829 --> 01:09:04,960
difficult for all of us in this

1850
01:09:08,870 --> 01:09:07,839
community is we understand the value of

1851
01:09:10,870 --> 01:09:08,880
this

1852
01:09:12,470 --> 01:09:10,880
conspiratorial

1853
01:09:15,430 --> 01:09:12,480
paranoid

1854
01:09:18,550 --> 01:09:15,440
paradigm that we're in and we're like

1855
01:09:22,070 --> 01:09:18,560
[\h__\h] a right that is right because

1856
01:09:25,030 --> 01:09:22,080
they are lying to us and it's provable

1857
01:09:28,309 --> 01:09:25,040
over and over and over again and that is

1858
01:09:29,349 --> 01:09:28,319
important to hold on to and i think that

1859
01:09:31,269 --> 01:09:29,359
you know

1860
01:09:32,789 --> 01:09:31,279
that that's part of the rub here right

1861
01:09:34,870 --> 01:09:32,799
is because now

1862
01:09:37,110 --> 01:09:34,880
you're really it's back to this two two

1863
01:09:38,550 --> 01:09:37,120
worlds like a foot in both worlds you

1864
01:09:40,470 --> 01:09:38,560
know and

1865
01:09:42,149 --> 01:09:40,480
like now we have two different another

1866
01:09:44,149 --> 01:09:42,159
two worlds you know one world is the

1867
01:09:48,900 --> 01:09:44,159
conspiracy world it's like

1868
01:09:54,790 --> 01:09:52,309
[Laughter]

1869
01:09:57,990 --> 01:09:54,800
think conspiracy think something

1870
01:09:59,750 --> 01:09:58,000
someone's getting [\h__\h] him exactly i

1871
01:10:02,790 --> 01:09:59,760
don't want to say that yeah look at that

1872
01:10:05,590 --> 01:10:02,800
built into society come on exactly it's

1873
01:10:07,910 --> 01:10:05,600
built in so i think that conspiratorial

1874
01:10:10,630 --> 01:10:07,920
perspective is kind of essential the

1875
01:10:13,750 --> 01:10:10,640
foot the other foot though is i need

1876
01:10:15,750 --> 01:10:13,760
discernment and i need rapid discernment

1877
01:10:18,470 --> 01:10:15,760
flat earth doesn't just doesn't deserve

1878
01:10:20,870 --> 01:10:18,480
more than 30 seconds of my time and when

1879
01:10:22,229 --> 01:10:20,880
it when it takes more than 30 seconds of

1880
01:10:24,229 --> 01:10:22,239
my time to

1881
01:10:25,910 --> 01:10:24,239
kind of understand that then the

1882
01:10:29,590 --> 01:10:25,920
question becomes back to the

1883
01:10:32,950 --> 01:10:29,600
conspiratorial part why is that

1884
01:10:36,390 --> 01:10:32,960
being perpetuated what what might i look

1885
01:10:38,630 --> 01:10:36,400
at in terms of why that exists why i've

1886
01:10:41,189 --> 01:10:38,640
been doing this show for 15 years i've

1887
01:10:44,550 --> 01:10:41,199
never had more people contact me like oh

1888
01:10:47,750 --> 01:10:44,560
you should do a debate on uh flat earth

1889
01:10:50,790 --> 01:10:47,760
something out there in the ethers is

1890
01:10:53,990 --> 01:10:50,800
trying to get this bubbled up to the top

1891
01:10:55,910 --> 01:10:54,000
because it it just throws [\h__\h] on our

1892
01:10:57,350 --> 01:10:55,920
whole community that there's the people

1893
01:10:59,510 --> 01:10:57,360
out there that actually believe in flat

1894
01:11:01,750 --> 01:10:59,520
earth when you talk to any normies and

1895
01:11:05,350 --> 01:11:01,760
most people in our lives are normies if

1896
01:11:09,110 --> 01:11:05,360
you mention flat earth you are it is

1897
01:11:11,669 --> 01:11:09,120
done it is a done kind of thing so um

1898
01:11:13,669 --> 01:11:11,679
and it should be because it's it's not

1899
01:11:16,550 --> 01:11:13,679
it doesn't deserve

1900
01:11:18,709 --> 01:11:16,560
serious scientific thought and then

1901
01:11:21,110 --> 01:11:18,719
number two i guess is

1902
01:11:22,229 --> 01:11:21,120
i think it's important this is my kind

1903
01:11:24,870 --> 01:11:22,239
of personal

1904
01:11:28,229 --> 01:11:24,880
hobbyhorse but to plant the flag

1905
01:11:30,790 --> 01:11:28,239
to plant the flag and not keep all doors

1906
01:11:33,189 --> 01:11:30,800
open well you know i don't know it could

1907
01:11:36,709 --> 01:11:33,199
be you know maybe there's a chance i

1908
01:11:39,990 --> 01:11:36,719
don't know no plant the flag and say no

1909
01:11:41,990 --> 01:11:40,000
it's ridiculous [\h__\h] but i get it i

1910
01:11:44,470 --> 01:11:42,000
get it in the realm of the

1911
01:11:46,149 --> 01:11:44,480
conspiratorial realm but yeah that one

1912
01:11:47,590 --> 01:11:46,159
doesn't pass

1913
01:11:49,830 --> 01:11:47,600
that test

1914
01:11:51,830 --> 01:11:49,840
and then the last one i want to throw in

1915
01:11:53,189 --> 01:11:51,840
which is kind of unrelated to that but i

1916
01:11:56,870 --> 01:11:53,199
want to get it out there and maybe it'll

1917
01:11:58,709 --> 01:11:56,880
spark a more discussion i also like the

1918
01:11:59,750 --> 01:11:58,719
as below so above

1919
01:12:02,390 --> 01:11:59,760
because

1920
01:12:04,229 --> 01:12:02,400
which is implied in what you're saying

1921
01:12:05,270 --> 01:12:04,239
as above so below

1922
01:12:09,510 --> 01:12:05,280
but

1923
01:12:11,669 --> 01:12:09,520
where as below so above gets us is

1924
01:12:13,750 --> 01:12:11,679
as we're talking about like you don't

1925
01:12:16,070 --> 01:12:13,760
want you don't think there's evil

1926
01:12:18,550 --> 01:12:16,080
[\h__\h] just look down here you don't have

1927
01:12:21,910 --> 01:12:18,560
to you don't have to contemplate demons

1928
01:12:24,470 --> 01:12:21,920
and all the rest just look here yes oh

1929
01:12:26,229 --> 01:12:24,480
might that also be reflected of course

1930
01:12:28,310 --> 01:12:26,239
because the two are

1931
01:12:29,910 --> 01:12:28,320
synonymous but anyways so

1932
01:12:32,149 --> 01:12:29,920
that's a really good point

1933
01:12:34,310 --> 01:12:32,159
on the table back to you well you know

1934
01:12:36,390 --> 01:12:34,320
okay so this brings me to a very weird

1935
01:12:38,310 --> 01:12:36,400
kind of point it may be hard to even get

1936
01:12:39,990 --> 01:12:38,320
out but you know there's a lot of

1937
01:12:42,070 --> 01:12:40,000
gatekeeping in the spiritual community

1938
01:12:44,950 --> 01:12:42,080
of course too you know i would point to

1939
01:12:46,390 --> 01:12:44,960
you know a pro a place like gaia tv is

1940
01:12:48,950 --> 01:12:46,400
is really interesting for a lot of

1941
01:12:50,550 --> 01:12:48,960
information and then there's a lot of

1942
01:12:52,630 --> 01:12:50,560
they really want us to feel like we're

1943
01:12:54,950 --> 01:12:52,640
all superheroes and we're going to be

1944
01:12:57,590 --> 01:12:54,960
transcending into different forms of

1945
01:12:59,910 --> 01:12:57,600
of physicality and

1946
01:13:02,149 --> 01:12:59,920
it's a it's a really it's convoluted in

1947
01:13:05,189 --> 01:13:02,159
my opinion there's a lot of convolution

1948
01:13:07,270 --> 01:13:05,199
spirit guides versus archetypes versus

1949
01:13:09,830 --> 01:13:07,280
feelings for what what is it is it does

1950
01:13:11,750 --> 01:13:09,840
it matter to discern or is it just a

1951
01:13:13,990 --> 01:13:11,760
perspective thing you know it's very

1952
01:13:15,030 --> 01:13:14,000
convoluted in there and it's it's hard

1953
01:13:17,270 --> 01:13:15,040
to kind of

1954
01:13:19,270 --> 01:13:17,280
dissect on again how do we bring it back

1955
01:13:21,030 --> 01:13:19,280
down to baseline how do we

1956
01:13:23,350 --> 01:13:21,040
what should be thrown off the table what

1957
01:13:26,229 --> 01:13:23,360
should be kept on you know can we call

1958
01:13:28,790 --> 01:13:26,239
it satanist can we call it luciferians

1959
01:13:32,070 --> 01:13:28,800
because of course in physical reality

1960
01:13:33,910 --> 01:13:32,080
they have those silly groups but then do

1961
01:13:37,030 --> 01:13:33,920
we take it to that next level where it's

1962
01:13:39,830 --> 01:13:37,040
demons and it's angels or is it just

1963
01:13:41,910 --> 01:13:39,840
that's a perspective of something that's

1964
01:13:42,950 --> 01:13:41,920
just naturally occurring

1965
01:13:45,510 --> 01:13:42,960
in this

1966
01:13:48,149 --> 01:13:45,520
experience of duality i mean whether we

1967
01:13:51,750 --> 01:13:48,159
can point to you know humans making the

1968
01:13:54,790 --> 01:13:51,760
decision to have divide and conquer put

1969
01:13:56,630 --> 01:13:54,800
into the society to [\h__\h] people up or if

1970
01:13:59,430 --> 01:13:56,640
it's literally the forces of the

1971
01:14:01,750 --> 01:13:59,440
universe like you know yin and yang

1972
01:14:04,790 --> 01:14:01,760
describe it perfectly and the opposite

1973
01:14:06,709 --> 01:14:04,800
is seated in each side you know it's

1974
01:14:08,310 --> 01:14:06,719
i want i said this on a couple podcasts

1975
01:14:09,990 --> 01:14:08,320
now and i again i'd like to sound like a

1976
01:14:12,630 --> 01:14:10,000
broken record sometimes i guess but it's

1977
01:14:14,070 --> 01:14:12,640
important to say that like it feels like

1978
01:14:16,790 --> 01:14:14,080
anyone that gets really behind the

1979
01:14:18,950 --> 01:14:16,800
curtain and gets to see what the evil

1980
01:14:20,630 --> 01:14:18,960
that's going on it's almost like

1981
01:14:26,229 --> 01:14:20,640
oh

1982
01:14:28,950 --> 01:14:26,239
falls apart or something like that this

1983
01:14:31,270 --> 01:14:28,960
push and pull of these opposing forces

1984
01:14:33,510 --> 01:14:31,280
this back to alchemy perhaps that these

1985
01:14:35,830 --> 01:14:33,520
two opposing forces kind of create this

1986
01:14:37,270 --> 01:14:35,840
middle ground of even being able to hear

1987
01:14:38,950 --> 01:14:37,280
to talk to each other

1988
01:14:41,350 --> 01:14:38,960
i don't know that's kind of wild it's a

1989
01:14:42,709 --> 01:14:41,360
little psychedelic but maybe i just like

1990
01:14:44,470 --> 01:14:42,719
to throw things at you and see what you

1991
01:14:46,630 --> 01:14:44,480
can do with it

1992
01:14:49,350 --> 01:14:46,640
i like that i'm still stuck in the in

1993
01:14:52,310 --> 01:14:49,360
the multiple worlds thing

1994
01:14:54,950 --> 01:14:52,320
let's clarify it no no no no i i'm not

1995
01:14:57,350 --> 01:14:54,960
opposing what you're saying i'm just

1996
01:15:01,110 --> 01:14:57,360
saying in parallel to that i think the

1997
01:15:03,350 --> 01:15:01,120
thing that trips us up andy is

1998
01:15:04,149 --> 01:15:03,360
we're always forced

1999
01:15:07,030 --> 01:15:04,159
to

2000
01:15:09,030 --> 01:15:07,040
like you say wake up and oh [\h__\h] hit the

2001
01:15:11,110 --> 01:15:09,040
alarm clock i got to get my ass to work

2002
01:15:13,110 --> 01:15:11,120
you know right this is the best route

2003
01:15:15,189 --> 01:15:13,120
this is the best way to go and traffic

2004
01:15:15,990 --> 01:15:15,199
is bad and the bridge is closed all that

2005
01:15:19,270 --> 01:15:16,000
[\h__\h]

2006
01:15:21,030 --> 01:15:19,280
that's a different world you know and so

2007
01:15:23,030 --> 01:15:21,040
we're always in these two different

2008
01:15:25,270 --> 01:15:23,040
worlds and we have a different set of

2009
01:15:26,950 --> 01:15:25,280
tools that work in one world and in

2010
01:15:29,350 --> 01:15:26,960
another world and what we're bringing to

2011
01:15:30,870 --> 01:15:29,360
the table is saying

2012
01:15:33,270 --> 01:15:30,880
in that world

2013
01:15:34,709 --> 01:15:33,280
of hit the alarm clock avoid the bridge

2014
01:15:35,990 --> 01:15:34,719
traffic

2015
01:15:37,750 --> 01:15:36,000
you also got to worry about these

2016
01:15:41,110 --> 01:15:37,760
[\h__\h] guys who are trying to jab you

2017
01:15:43,830 --> 01:15:41,120
in the arm in order to you know that you

2018
01:15:48,149 --> 01:15:43,840
never thought that was part of the alarm

2019
01:15:49,830 --> 01:15:48,159
clock world and that doesn't necessarily

2020
01:15:51,990 --> 01:15:49,840
mean the same thing in the spiritual

2021
01:15:53,510 --> 01:15:52,000
world like i don't want to start i don't

2022
01:15:54,870 --> 01:15:53,520
want to start making that connection

2023
01:15:56,709 --> 01:15:54,880
right off the bat and say right well

2024
01:16:00,149 --> 01:15:56,719
they're trying to jab you in the arm

2025
01:16:03,030 --> 01:16:00,159
because spiritually there's a like

2026
01:16:04,790 --> 01:16:03,040
i'm open maybe but the first part i want

2027
01:16:07,750 --> 01:16:04,800
to process is

2028
01:16:09,110 --> 01:16:07,760
yes the bridge really is out just

2029
01:16:10,870 --> 01:16:09,120
because they haven't done the

2030
01:16:12,310 --> 01:16:10,880
maintenance on it that isn't a

2031
01:16:14,310 --> 01:16:12,320
conspiracy

2032
01:16:16,149 --> 01:16:14,320
but the jab in the arm that they're

2033
01:16:19,350 --> 01:16:16,159
trying to do to my kids at school

2034
01:16:20,470 --> 01:16:19,360
without my consent yes that is a

2035
01:16:23,030 --> 01:16:20,480
conspiracy

2036
01:16:24,950 --> 01:16:23,040
so i can navigate the whole thing and

2037
01:16:27,669 --> 01:16:24,960
then we can have a discussion about my

2038
01:16:29,510 --> 01:16:27,679
trip right

2039
01:16:32,390 --> 01:16:29,520
yeah okay i like that and now you know

2040
01:16:35,750 --> 01:16:32,400
i'm guilty of of uh you know

2041
01:16:37,030 --> 01:16:35,760
desiring that integration and i think

2042
01:16:38,149 --> 01:16:37,040
you know now that you put it this way

2043
01:16:39,590 --> 01:16:38,159
it's a really

2044
01:16:41,030 --> 01:16:39,600
it's a good thing to play with because

2045
01:16:43,510 --> 01:16:41,040
it's like you can get lost in

2046
01:16:45,189 --> 01:16:43,520
integration as well perhaps where and

2047
01:16:47,750 --> 01:16:45,199
maybe that's something that you know

2048
01:16:50,790 --> 01:16:47,760
they would look forward to just

2049
01:16:53,110 --> 01:16:50,800
confusion by a simple suggestion right

2050
01:16:55,510 --> 01:16:53,120
and i've pondered why psychedelics were

2051
01:16:57,990 --> 01:16:55,520
used for so long because uh yeah

2052
01:16:59,910 --> 01:16:58,000
suggestion i can see that but

2053
01:17:02,630 --> 01:16:59,920
man if if a certain percentage we're

2054
01:17:04,470 --> 01:17:02,640
having my psychedelic experience

2055
01:17:06,470 --> 01:17:04,480
none of that brainwashing [\h__\h] was

2056
01:17:07,990 --> 01:17:06,480
even real and we would i would have been

2057
01:17:09,270 --> 01:17:08,000
laughing at them well maybe they just

2058
01:17:11,590 --> 01:17:09,280
get shot in the head of three times

2059
01:17:13,590 --> 01:17:11,600
after that you know but you know i had a

2060
01:17:15,430 --> 01:17:13,600
hard time understanding i gotta jump in

2061
01:17:17,510 --> 01:17:15,440
there because cause like that to me is

2062
01:17:19,030 --> 01:17:17,520
like a super super interesting point on

2063
01:17:21,350 --> 01:17:19,040
a bunch of different levels okay so you

2064
01:17:23,350 --> 01:17:21,360
go back and you look at the psychedelic

2065
01:17:25,189 --> 01:17:23,360
experiments and you look at the mk ultra

2066
01:17:27,030 --> 01:17:25,199
thing and one of the things that pops

2067
01:17:28,390 --> 01:17:27,040
out to me again i don't know this for

2068
01:17:30,630 --> 01:17:28,400
sure but if i'm going to put on that

2069
01:17:31,750 --> 01:17:30,640
rational in this world avoid the bridge

2070
01:17:33,750 --> 01:17:31,760
hat

2071
01:17:35,910 --> 01:17:33,760
i go back to your point andy is like

2072
01:17:38,149 --> 01:17:35,920
they're not that [\h__\h] smart so like

2073
01:17:40,070 --> 01:17:38,159
they really thought they didn't know

2074
01:17:42,470 --> 01:17:40,080
they're like oh man you know

2075
01:17:44,870 --> 01:17:42,480
we'll be able to mind control people

2076
01:17:47,430 --> 01:17:44,880
will be able to suggest things

2077
01:17:50,310 --> 01:17:47,440
they didn't they really believe just

2078
01:17:51,669 --> 01:17:50,320
like you know uh people with diff

2079
01:17:55,350 --> 01:17:51,679
brought up in certain kind of crazy

2080
01:17:57,910 --> 01:17:55,360
religions like scientology or mormonism

2081
01:17:59,910 --> 01:17:57,920
or catholicism then they have these

2082
01:18:02,709 --> 01:17:59,920
beliefs saying throw a grenade out there

2083
01:18:05,430 --> 01:18:02,719
see if anyone see if it goes off

2084
01:18:06,470 --> 01:18:05,440
yeah so maybe um yeah maybe just simply

2085
01:18:08,149 --> 01:18:06,480
to

2086
01:18:08,950 --> 01:18:08,159
because i would say i guess i answer my

2087
01:18:11,430 --> 01:18:08,960
own

2088
01:18:14,470 --> 01:18:11,440
question about why use psychedelics you

2089
01:18:17,350 --> 01:18:14,480
know uh is that you know at a young age

2090
01:18:19,350 --> 01:18:17,360
or an untrained mind is gonna

2091
01:18:20,630 --> 01:18:19,360
you know be in a world of chaos after

2092
01:18:22,550 --> 01:18:20,640
something like that if you don't have

2093
01:18:24,950 --> 01:18:22,560
some sort of person to kind of be like

2094
01:18:27,430 --> 01:18:24,960
well to help guide you back in in some

2095
01:18:29,750 --> 01:18:27,440
cases not a guru necessarily but you

2096
01:18:31,510 --> 01:18:29,760
know it took me a long time to

2097
01:18:32,709 --> 01:18:31,520
reintegrate into reality because i

2098
01:18:34,070 --> 01:18:32,719
didn't know

2099
01:18:35,350 --> 01:18:34,080
you know my whole world had been thrown

2100
01:18:36,870 --> 01:18:35,360
upside down when i started doing

2101
01:18:38,870 --> 01:18:36,880
psychedelics you know i spent a lot of

2102
01:18:39,990 --> 01:18:38,880
time reading dead people in bookstores

2103
01:18:42,229 --> 01:18:40,000
because i didn't have a lot of people

2104
01:18:43,669 --> 01:18:42,239
around me to bounce ideas off of but

2105
01:18:46,149 --> 01:18:43,679
yeah i guess you know it could just be

2106
01:18:48,310 --> 01:18:46,159
used in that way to cause the confusion

2107
01:18:49,510 --> 01:18:48,320
they love to create perhaps

2108
01:18:51,510 --> 01:18:49,520
you know well

2109
01:18:52,790 --> 01:18:51,520
and i think we're saying the same thing

2110
01:18:56,070 --> 01:18:52,800
but it's like

2111
01:18:58,229 --> 01:18:56,080
it could be used that way because they

2112
01:19:03,270 --> 01:18:58,239
really were dumb

2113
01:19:04,870 --> 01:19:03,280
there was probably a community in there

2114
01:19:06,550 --> 01:19:04,880
that because as soon as people start

2115
01:19:09,270 --> 01:19:06,560
using this and this is back to terence

2116
01:19:11,669 --> 01:19:09,280
mckenna you know it's like hey man

2117
01:19:13,750 --> 01:19:11,679
when these mushrooms grow out of the cow

2118
01:19:16,070 --> 01:19:13,760
pasture

2119
01:19:18,149 --> 01:19:16,080
there's no there's no controlling what's

2120
01:19:19,750 --> 01:19:18,159
gonna happen you know right so like you

2121
01:19:20,709 --> 01:19:19,760
said you know some people have the bag

2122
01:19:22,709 --> 01:19:20,719
of mushrooms and they have one

2123
01:19:23,910 --> 01:19:22,719
experience the other but you got a bunch

2124
01:19:25,189 --> 01:19:23,920
of mushrooms growing out there in the

2125
01:19:26,229 --> 01:19:25,199
field and people eating them but there's

2126
01:19:28,149 --> 01:19:26,239
going to be some people are going to

2127
01:19:29,669 --> 01:19:28,159
wake up and the same thing i think is

2128
01:19:32,070 --> 01:19:29,679
true with sydney gottlieb just so just

2129
01:19:33,030 --> 01:19:32,080
because he doesn't get it doesn't mean

2130
01:19:35,510 --> 01:19:33,040
that

2131
01:19:37,910 --> 01:19:35,520
some of those people didn't get it right

2132
01:19:39,189 --> 01:19:37,920
okay i like that you know where it's

2133
01:19:42,470 --> 01:19:39,199
again it's

2134
01:19:45,030 --> 01:19:42,480
it's that mixture of intent and mistake

2135
01:19:47,830 --> 01:19:45,040
or unknowing yeah like ken keezy once

2136
01:19:48,709 --> 01:19:47,840
said that lsd to describe lsd it's

2137
01:19:50,550 --> 01:19:48,719
it's

2138
01:19:52,630 --> 01:19:50,560
we opened up a door

2139
01:19:54,149 --> 01:19:52,640
or the government opened up a door

2140
01:19:55,270 --> 01:19:54,159
they saw something in it they didn't

2141
01:19:57,990 --> 01:19:55,280
understand

2142
01:19:59,910 --> 01:19:58,000
they put people in that room to see what

2143
01:20:01,910 --> 01:19:59,920
it was those people came out and

2144
01:20:03,189 --> 01:20:01,920
wouldn't listen to anything they the

2145
01:20:05,270 --> 01:20:03,199
people putting them in the room set

2146
01:20:07,270 --> 01:20:05,280
anymore and they said okay let's close

2147
01:20:09,110 --> 01:20:07,280
that door and close it up forever

2148
01:20:11,030 --> 01:20:09,120
so in a way that kind of speaks to that

2149
01:20:12,470 --> 01:20:11,040
ignorance that fear ignorance that okay

2150
01:20:14,950 --> 01:20:12,480
let's shut the friggin door i don't know

2151
01:20:16,790 --> 01:20:14,960
what we just did to society but but then

2152
01:20:19,030 --> 01:20:16,800
of course you can go into how the 60s

2153
01:20:21,590 --> 01:20:19,040
and the psychedelic revolution was a way

2154
01:20:23,830 --> 01:20:21,600
to discredit a real movement you know so

2155
01:20:26,709 --> 01:20:23,840
that's a whole nother you know that's an

2156
01:20:29,510 --> 01:20:26,719
intentional side of it perhaps you know

2157
01:20:31,830 --> 01:20:29,520
plus you can go into

2158
01:20:35,510 --> 01:20:31,840
the pharmacological

2159
01:20:38,390 --> 01:20:35,520
archaeological work in pompeii you know

2160
01:20:39,430 --> 01:20:38,400
the city that was covered by right you i

2161
01:20:41,669 --> 01:20:39,440
think you know where i'm going oh yeah

2162
01:20:45,510 --> 01:20:41,679
yes and they look in the medicine chest

2163
01:20:48,470 --> 01:20:45,520
and oh there's cocaine there's uh uh

2164
01:20:50,629 --> 01:20:48,480
cannabis and there is i forget you

2165
01:20:51,990 --> 01:20:50,639
probably know uh you know the name of

2166
01:21:03,830 --> 01:20:52,000
the

2167
01:21:06,950 --> 01:21:03,840
preserved right so it's like again

2168
01:21:08,149 --> 01:21:06,960
that's classic us to think we opened the

2169
01:21:10,149 --> 01:21:08,159
door

2170
01:21:12,390 --> 01:21:10,159
this swish

2171
01:21:14,709 --> 01:21:12,400
we didn't open no door

2172
01:21:16,550 --> 01:21:14,719
somebody was brushing their hands in the

2173
01:21:19,030 --> 01:21:16,560
wheat field and brought it up to their

2174
01:21:20,790 --> 01:21:19,040
face and something happened

2175
01:21:22,310 --> 01:21:20,800
thousands of years ago which is what

2176
01:21:25,830 --> 01:21:22,320
terence mckenna

2177
01:21:29,030 --> 01:21:25,840
has said it is undoubtedly true and

2178
01:21:30,709 --> 01:21:29,040
so anyways i'll throw that on the table

2179
01:21:32,790 --> 01:21:30,719
man we could go in a lot of places from

2180
01:21:35,270 --> 01:21:32,800
here we've been going for a while and

2181
01:21:36,790 --> 01:21:35,280
i man i would just love to have you back

2182
01:21:38,950 --> 01:21:36,800
sometime to have more of these this is

2183
01:21:40,310 --> 01:21:38,960
great i i don't know where we would

2184
01:21:44,310 --> 01:21:40,320
where would you like to go from here

2185
01:21:45,830 --> 01:21:44,320
because we've covered so much ground

2186
01:21:48,390 --> 01:21:45,840
you know what i'd like to do i'd like to

2187
01:21:50,070 --> 01:21:48,400
put this out on my channel too

2188
01:21:51,669 --> 01:21:50,080
this is uh

2189
01:21:54,470 --> 01:21:51,679
great because this is such an

2190
01:21:56,790 --> 01:21:54,480
interesting discussion and then i think

2191
01:21:57,990 --> 01:21:56,800
you and i ought to huddle and talk about

2192
01:22:00,310 --> 01:21:58,000
doing

2193
01:22:02,310 --> 01:22:00,320
maybe even like a mini series on this

2194
01:22:04,790 --> 01:22:02,320
because i think it's so

2195
01:22:06,470 --> 01:22:04,800
critical to this because there's a lot

2196
01:22:07,910 --> 01:22:06,480
of different ways to slice it i think

2197
01:22:10,070 --> 01:22:07,920
that would

2198
01:22:11,830 --> 01:22:10,080
that does lead down you know the river

2199
01:22:13,990 --> 01:22:11,840
you know they they kind of merge at some

2200
01:22:15,990 --> 01:22:14,000
point and we didn't quite get them to

2201
01:22:17,590 --> 01:22:16,000
merge all the way

2202
01:22:18,790 --> 01:22:17,600
yet

2203
01:22:20,470 --> 01:22:18,800
but i think it's potent there's a

2204
01:22:21,830 --> 01:22:20,480
potential there to do so i would be

2205
01:22:25,189 --> 01:22:21,840
totally open to that i'm sure the

2206
01:22:27,669 --> 01:22:25,199
audience would love that as well so yeah

2207
01:22:29,430 --> 01:22:27,679
so for now we'll wrap up you know any

2208
01:22:30,709 --> 01:22:29,440
last words before we

2209
01:22:32,149 --> 01:22:30,719
you know have you plug your show and

2210
01:22:34,629 --> 01:22:32,159
everything

2211
01:22:37,430 --> 01:22:34,639
last word really is

2212
01:22:40,070 --> 01:22:37,440
i'm just really excited about this

2213
01:22:42,390 --> 01:22:40,080
because the grenades went off and

2214
01:22:43,830 --> 01:22:42,400
it was just like i was hoping for at the

2215
01:22:46,629 --> 01:22:43,840
beginning like

2216
01:22:48,390 --> 01:22:46,639
no one ran you know no jumped out of the

2217
01:22:50,310 --> 01:22:48,400
foxhole you didn't jump out of the fox

2218
01:22:52,950 --> 01:22:50,320
all right it's like no that's what you

2219
01:22:54,790 --> 01:22:52,960
think you know you think that uh okay

2220
01:22:57,669 --> 01:22:54,800
great let's let's dive into it and hash

2221
01:22:59,750 --> 01:22:57,679
it out yes at its core

2222
01:23:02,950 --> 01:22:59,760
i really really like where you're coming

2223
01:23:04,870 --> 01:23:02,960
from so i i want to go on that

2224
01:23:06,790 --> 01:23:04,880
i want to go on that journey with you

2225
01:23:08,229 --> 01:23:06,800
because we all know especially in our

2226
01:23:10,310 --> 01:23:08,239
community that's what keeps bringing us

2227
01:23:12,070 --> 01:23:10,320
back to this community is these are the

2228
01:23:13,590 --> 01:23:12,080
people we do want to go on the journey

2229
01:23:15,990 --> 01:23:13,600
with because there's a lot of other

2230
01:23:17,750 --> 01:23:16,000
people in our life are like oh man just

2231
01:23:19,189 --> 01:23:17,760
put on the freaking ball game because i

2232
01:23:20,790 --> 01:23:19,199
don't even wanna

2233
01:23:22,550 --> 01:23:20,800
yeah if you can't if you know it's like

2234
01:23:24,790 --> 01:23:22,560
building a house if you can't get the

2235
01:23:26,709 --> 01:23:24,800
foundation with a relationship going

2236
01:23:28,310 --> 01:23:26,719
then all the other layers are just gonna

2237
01:23:30,149 --> 01:23:28,320
fall apart so

2238
01:23:32,229 --> 01:23:30,159
yeah it's it's um we're finding a lot of

2239
01:23:34,149 --> 01:23:32,239
uh common ground in this community i i

2240
01:23:35,910 --> 01:23:34,159
love being a part of it and you know

2241
01:23:38,149 --> 01:23:35,920
when i took psychedelics

2242
01:23:40,470 --> 01:23:38,159
and had those crazy feelings i didn't

2243
01:23:42,550 --> 01:23:40,480
have a community like this so it's it's

2244
01:23:44,229 --> 01:23:42,560
great that it's expanding i'm so glad

2245
01:23:46,229 --> 01:23:44,239
that i got to have you on and we got to

2246
01:23:48,629 --> 01:23:46,239
know each other and and then yeah

2247
01:23:50,390 --> 01:23:48,639
further work ahead i appreciate it and i

2248
01:23:53,270 --> 01:23:50,400
would love to do that so without further

2249
01:23:55,030 --> 01:23:53,280
ado alex for anyone that doesn't know

2250
01:23:56,950 --> 01:23:55,040
at this point in the game please let

2251
01:23:59,590 --> 01:23:56,960
them know where they can find you

2252
01:24:03,830 --> 01:23:59,600
it's skeptico and it's with a ko on the

2253
01:24:05,990 --> 01:24:03,840
end and uh you'll find it and uh

2254
01:24:09,350 --> 01:24:06,000
and you'll like it or not like it and

2255
01:24:11,270 --> 01:24:09,360
that's the way it goes damn right

2256
01:24:12,950 --> 01:24:11,280
all right everyone well thank you so

2257
01:24:15,030 --> 01:24:12,960
much for tuning in to this episode of

2258
01:24:17,110 --> 01:24:15,040
the deep share with alex sakaris and go

2259
01:24:18,070 --> 01:24:17,120
check out his books check out all of his

2260
01:24:20,709 --> 01:24:18,080
shows

2261
01:24:23,110 --> 01:24:20,719
and yeah you will hear from us again so